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Use this WAZE strategy!

3K views 48 replies 20 participants last post by  Immoralized 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
  • We will know that taking the most efficient (direct) route is what makes upfront pricing a success for Uber.

    So take the THIRD most efficient route instead! Gives you a better chance at getting a fairer slice of the pie.

    Here are some examples.

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    Update: I noticed that AnatolianTiger got his tolls paid ($13.64) on top of the percentage cut from the upfront fare where he attempted to rip off the pax but only got paid $84 instead of $124 (Airport to Parramatta via LCT & M2).

    So this Waze strategy needs to also factor in taking toll roads if it reduces the time of the trip as the tolls will be paid regardless of whether it was the best route.

    For the time being keep periodically monitoring your cut by just taking 77.5% or 72.5% from the upfront fare to see if it matches.

    One day it will stop matching, more often than not. That's when this Waze strategy will need to be used.

    Get in the habit early?
 
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#5 ·
waze 1º option by defect is "faster route" if there's traffic, he'll recalculate the route, so it's possible to you to make more miles, but be there faster. This is automatic, but everytime you start a trip, you can change the definitions (I advise you to do it while PAX is looking outsider or so) to the longest distance trip, whenever are traffic or not.
 
#7 ·
The upfront pricing module will be based on roughly the 4th most efficient route - as it factors in a buffer for possible traffic or missed turns (they are a business and are not about to lose money by under quoting).

I definitely feel that Uber were testing this 4th route in the past month or two because my pax even pointed out at times that we were taking a bad route.

By taking the 3rd and not the 1st, you get closer to your usual commission rate when calculated from the upfront fare.

You can be super efficient if you like, but then you're just giving Uber an even larger commission. Can you live with that? Looks like most of us cannot.
 
#12 ·
I was posting on another thread and saw this one so I will post here.

We have had the upfront fares for awhile, here are some tips to make more money.

1. Turn off the Uber nav and use a reputable navigation. I use Waze.
2. Before going into drive and hitting the gas pedal, start the navigation and click routes, which will list 3 routes.
3. Confirm the destination and ask if the rider has a preferred route.
4. If the rider does have a preference (tourists and non-locals), compare against the routes in the navigation. This is when you can discuss other options if the riders route is crap.
5. If the rider does not care, I usually pick the most efficient route (with more miles) and communicate the route to the rider.

This approach covers, confirming the destination, discussing the route, and maximizing the amount you can make on a ride.

Examples from yesterday: Two rides that were very similar. Ubers route would have paid about $50. Waze route that was actually a couple minutes faster paid $60-$70. Upfront pricing for both of these trips was $95. Uber still pocketed more than 25%.

Just to be clear on upfront pricing, Uber is not ripping drivers off. They are ripping riders off. We have seen fares of $100+ and the driver getting paid $30 based on time and mileage. This solves some pains with rides as riders are savvy to request a specific route to save money. End result, you are being paid at the minute rate because of the route the rider chooses. The benefits of the upfront pricing, it leaves room for drivers to make mistakes and it not affect what the rider pays. It offers transparency to the rider on what they will pay.
 
#18 ·
The problem is that we as drivers don't know the exact fare. We only know what uber tells us, so we only pay (or pass) GST for the amount uber gives us. For the "fare difference", Uber can deal with it themselves just like what they do for the service fee. I guess ATO wouldn't care where they get GST from as long as it is received in full.
ATO doesn't care where the tax money or GST come from as long as it is paid in full.

That is absolutely correct! They are not DOT and have no interest in running transport companies. All they are interested is collecting taxes.

As long as Uber squares it up with the ATO they can get away with it :p Not to mention ATO collecting way more taxes now then they were with the taxi drivers/owners always under declaring when it was mostly "all cash".
 
#19 ·
I was posting on another thread and saw this one so I will post here.

We have had the upfront fares for awhile, here are some tips to make more money.

1. Turn off the Uber nav and use a reputable navigation. I use Waze.
2. Before going into drive and hitting the gas pedal, start the navigation and click routes, which will list 3 routes.
3. Confirm the destination and ask if the rider has a preferred route.
4. If the rider does have a preference (tourists and non-locals), compare against the routes in the navigation. This is when you can discuss other options if the riders route is crap.
5. If the rider does not care, I usually pick the most efficient route (with more miles) and communicate the route to the rider.

This approach covers, confirming the destination, discussing the route, and maximizing the amount you can make on a ride.

Examples from yesterday: Two rides that were very similar. Ubers route would have paid about $50. Waze route that was actually a couple minutes faster paid $60-$70. Upfront pricing for both of these trips was $95. Uber still pocketed more than 25%.

Just to be clear on upfront pricing, Uber is not ripping drivers off. They are ripping riders off. We have seen fares of $100+ and the driver getting paid $30 based on time and mileage. This solves some pains with rides as riders are savvy to request a specific route to save money. End result, you are being paid at the minute rate because of the route the rider chooses. The benefits of the upfront pricing, it leaves room for drivers to make mistakes and it not affect what the rider pays. It offers transparency to the rider on what they will pay.
how are they not ripping drivers off ???? if we are not getting the 22 1/2 % or 27 1/2 % of what the pax pays answer that please

Show me the fare of $100 and driver recieving $30. Dont send a U.S fare because its not the same. Every Australian screenshot I seen has it calculating the same commission with the same fare price between rider and driver.
you do a fare then ask the customer to look at there fare you will see then
 
#21 ·
how are they not ripping drivers off ???? if we are not getting the 22 1/2 % or 27 1/2 % of what the pax pays answer that please

you do a fare then ask the customer to look at there fare you will see then
Read the agreement you have with Uber. It's simple. We as drivers agreed to the per mile and minute rate. Uber can charge whatever they please. They are holding up to their end the agreement.

I am interested in seeing the Austrialian agreement as I would believe this if it explicitly says that a driver is be paid a percentage of what Rider pays.
 
#20 ·
In Australia we do not get paid on distance and time, we are paid a percentage of the fare (However it is calculated) At this moment in time that has not changed. As for seeing customer invoice, just log into your uber account and check it, as it is issued in your own name.
 
#23 ·
2. Service Fee. In consideration of the Company’s provision of the Uber Services to you, you agree to pay Company a service fee on a per Transportation Services transaction basis, currently calculated as a percentage of the Fare Calculation as set forth below:
If you were first activated as a driver-partner before 24 April 2016:
Trip Type uberX trips uberASSIST trips uberXL trips uberSELECT trips Service Fee (GST inclusive) 22% 22% 22% 22%
If you were first activated as a driver-partner on or after 24 April 2016:
Trip Type uberX trips uberASSIST trips uberXL trips uberSELECT trips Service Fee (GST inclusive) 27.5% 27.5% 27.5% 27.5%
 
#24 ·
Can you show section 8 and the addendum?This looks just like the U.S. agreement.

My interpretation and experience is that section 8 shows what drivers will be paid per mile/minute and explicitly says that Uber will charge the Rider whatever they choose and the driver will be paid based on the service agreement/pay schedule. This should show the per minute and mile rate along with the base fare and cancel rate.

It may be different but as I stated I do not see why Uber would make their business model different. They lost 4 billion last year and this model increases their margins.

The legal jargon is elusive as it states the fare calculation which is mile and minute, base fare.

Here is how trips are broken down.
 

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#25 ·
That the agreement i accepted in Australia and was a direct screenshot before clicking I accept.

Nah they only referenced it not going to go into T&C to look through it for all the referencing.
 
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#26 ·
See also service fee addendum posted b4

Fare Calculation and Your Payment

8.1 You can charge a fare to Users for each instance of completed Transportation Services that you provide to a User that are obtained via the Uber Services ("Fare"). Rasier Pacific will calculate a recommendation of the Fare that you can elect to charge Users ("Fare Calculation"). As at 1 December 2017, Rasier Pacific determines the Fare Calculation as a
base fare amount plus distance (as determined by Rasier Pacific using location-based services enabled through your mobile device and/or time amounts, as detailed at www.uber.com/cities for the applicable Territory). You can also charge the User for any applicable road, bridge, ferry, tunnel and airport charges and any other fees (including innercity congestion, environmental or miscellaneous charges as reasonably determined by the Uber Services) ("Tolls"), taxes and/or fees incurred during the provision of Transportation Services, whether charged by a third party or Rasier Pacific. Rasier Pacific reserves the right to change the Fare Calculation at any time in Rasier Pacific's discretion. Rasier Pacific will provide you with notice in the event that any such change would result in a change in the recommended Fare. Continued use of the Uber Services after any such change shall constitute your consent to such change. You appoint Rasier Pacific as your limited payment collection agent solely to accept the Fare, applicable Tolls, and, depending on the region and/or if requested by you, applicable taxes and fees from the User on your behalf via the Uber Services' payment processing functionality, and agree that the User's payment to Rasier Pacific shall be considered the same as payment made directly by the User to you. If a User cancels their request for Transportation Services prior to your arrival, Rasier Pacific may charge that User a cancellation fee on your behalf, and a Service Fee will be payable to Rasier Pacific.

8.2 The parties acknowledge and agree that as between you and Rasier Pacific, the Fare Calculation is a recommended amount, and the primary purpose of the Fare Calculation is to act as the default Fare in the event you do not negotiate a different Fare. You shall always have the right to charge a Fare that is less than the pre-arranged Fare Calculation ("Negotiated Fare"). Rasier Pacific agrees to remit, or cause to be remitted, to you on at least a weekly basis, (a) the Fare less the applicable Service Fee and other fees charged by Rasier Pacific; (b) the Tolls (excluding applicable airport charges, which Rasier Pacific may pay to the airport on your behalf); (c) any incentive payments made under clause 13; and (d) depending on the region, certain taxes and ancillary fees (where applicable). If you have separately agreed to any other amounts being deducted from your Fares (such as vehicle financing, lease payments, government fees and charges, etc), those amounts will be deducted before remittance to you, and Rasier Pacific will determine the order of any such deductions from the Fare (as between you and Rasier Pacific). Rasier Pacific reserves the right to adjust payment in relation to a particular Fare for reasons such as inefficient routes, failure to properly end a particular instance of Transportation Services in the Driver App, or technical error in the Uber Services. In more serious situations, such as fraud, charges for Transportation Services that were not provided or User complaints, Rasier Pacific may cancel a Fare entirely or if the Fare has already been paid, require reimbursement of the Fare from you. Rasier Pacific reserves the right, in its sole discretion, to seek reimbursement from you if Rasier Pacific discovers payment processing errors. Rasier Pacific may obtain reimbursement of any amounts owed by you to Rasier Pacific by deducting from future Fares owed to you, debiting your card on file or your bank account on record, or seeking reimbursement from you by any other lawful means. You authorise Rasier Pacific to use any or all of the above methods to seek reimbursement.
 
#33 ·
We know now that taking the most efficient (direct) route is what makes upfront pricing a success for Uber.

So take the THIRD most efficient route instead! Gives you a better chance at getting a fairer slice of the pie.

Here are some examples.

View attachment 217054

View attachment 217055

View attachment 217056
Why
We know now that taking the most efficient (direct) route is what makes upfront pricing a success for Uber.

So take the THIRD most efficient route instead! Gives you a better chance at getting a fairer slice of the pie.

Here are some examples.

View attachment 217054

View attachment 217055

View attachment 217056
by third you mean quickest?

We know now that taking the most efficient (direct) route is what makes upfront pricing a success for Uber.

So take the THIRD most efficient route instead! Gives you a better chance at getting a fairer slice of the pie.

Here are some examples.

View attachment 217054

View attachment 217055

View attachment 217056
Ok. Choose route by km. Got it
 
#34 ·
We know now that taking the most efficient (direct) route is what makes upfront pricing a success for Uber.

So take the THIRD most efficient route instead! Gives you a better chance at getting a fairer slice of the pie.

Here are some examples.

View attachment 217054

View attachment 217055

View attachment 217056
It's not as simple as that. Maximising revenue from upfront fares is the name of the game, but two other things should be taken into account: ping frequency and trip time. If there is not much of a wait between pings then you should not automatically take the longer route - a route that is 10% longer is no good to you if it takes you 30% more time due to traffic. Reason: the distance component of our revenue is weighted much heavier than the time component. $/trip is a good metric, however $/hr takes into account how long it takes to earn the money and therefore how much can be earned in a given period of time.

In your examples above, the first one is a no-brainer. However, in your second and third examples, taking the alternate route results in lower revenue per hour due to lower traffic speed. Assuming you receive $2 base, $1.16/km and $0.32/minute, taking the original route in the second example gives revenue/hr of $72 vs $65; a 10% increase. And in the third example, taking the original route yields an equivalent revenue/hr of $69 vs $65; a 6% increase.

Conclusion - when it's busy, only take the longer route if the trip can be completed in the same amount of time, or if the extra time added taken on an alternate route does not negate the benefit of the increased distance.
 
#45 ·
We know now that taking the most efficient (direct) route is what makes upfront pricing a success for Uber.

So take the THIRD most efficient route instead! Gives you a better chance at getting a fairer slice of the pie.

Here are some examples.

View attachment 217054

View attachment 217055

View attachment 217056
You make pennies for time more pennies for distance...

Never take the longer time if the distance isn't also substantially longer.

Faster you get the rider out of your vehicle sooner you get the next rider.

Now, if you have three routes and one is longer distance and shortest time, that is the best way to go
 
#46 ·
Now, if you have three routes and one is longer distance and shortest time, that is the best way to go
As from April 1 we are due to pay a levy of 0.10/km to the state government. Uber has decided to pass this levy onto riders. However, do more km than estimated in a fixed fare and you end up paying the levy yourself.

ie. fixed fare based on 14km and 30 min
actual fare 20km and 26 min

levy fixed fare 14 times $0.10 =$1.40
actual levy 20 times $0,10= $2.00

Driver ends up paying $0.60 out of his own pocket. Although, in this example it may still be worth it.
 
#47 · (Edited)
This thread still doesnt make any sense to me.
Show me an example where you have taken the longer route in kms and less time in minutes and the fare means you pocket more money due to the trip reverting to time and distance as opposed to fixed fares. Send through a screenshot of the fare.

I have checked all my fares on upfront pricing. I have never been paid using time and distance like it has in the U.S. I get paid 78% of the riders upfront fare.

I echo Sleepos comments. It doesnt matter which route you take and itll be a fixed fare. For it to revert to time and distance the route needs substantially longer. Who defines 'substantially'? Uber havent even clarified this in their legal agreement.
 
#48 ·
As from April 1 we are due to pay a levy of 0.10/km to the state government. Uber has decided to pass this levy onto riders. However, do more km than estimated in a fixed fare and you end up paying the levy yourself.

ie. fixed fare based on 14km and 30 min
actual fare 20km and 26 min

levy fixed fare 14 times $0.10 =$1.40
actual levy 20 times $0,10= $2.00

Driver ends up paying $0.60 out of his own pocket. Although, in this example it may still be worth it.
i don't think the govt will be bothered to keep tabs on actual kms driven - ie. driver will never pay out of his own pocket.

It will go on the kms charged to the pax in the upfront fare, unless the trip is adjusted. Either way pax pays not driver.

Sleepo and Evil can do the "told you so" dance for as long as they like. Eventually the tables will flip on them.

Until then, dance away my friends.
 
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