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Uber has to pay Alaska for claiming drivers are IC

Discussion in 'News' started by Sacto Burbs, Sep 6, 2015.

  1. Sacto Burbs

    Sacto Burbs

    Location:
    SF Peninsula
    Driving:
    UberX
    And another state sets the bar

    http://www.alaskapublic.org/2015/09/03/uber-agrees-to-pay-state-78k-for-misclassifying-employees/


    Uber to pay state $78K for misclassifying drivers
    By Anne Hillman, Urban Affairs Desk | September 3, 2015


    Uber, the taxi-like ridesharing service, has agreed to pay the state $77,925 because they misclassified drivers as independent contractors instead of employees.

    The company operated in Anchorage for six months then pulled out in March because Uber could not come to an agreement with the municipality to legally operate in the city. The muni said the company was violating the taxi ordinance. Now, the company is also prohibited from operating in the state until they comply with the state’s classification laws.

    According to a statement from the Department of Labor and Workforce Development, labeling workers as contractors lets companies avoid paying unemployment insurance, taxes, and worker compensation premiums. It also violates the Alaska Workers’ Compensation Act. The money will go toward covering uninsured injured workers claims.

    Similar lawsuits have been brought against the company throughout the country.
     
  2. glados

    glados

    Location:
    .
    1) Uber settled without an admission of guilt, this does not set a precedent in any state.

    2) Uber found it cheaper to settle for $78k than to continue the lawsuit.

    3) Uber is actually CLOSING DOWN in Alaska... Is this what you want? :)

    ------

    Facts about being treated as employees:

    - No more surges or flexibility. Your Uber manager can tell you to get out and work when there's high demand... no need for surges anymore (which pax hates).

    - No more driving vehicle of your choice. If you don't have a low maintenance vehicle like a Prius, you're out.

    - No driving for other ridesharing companies. If you're employed with Uber, they can prohibit you from working for other ridesharing companies.

    - Less take home pay. Uber will have to pay burdenous overhead and red tape to make regulators and the state happy, like payrolls tax, unemployment fund, etc. These come out of YOUR pay.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2015
  3. poopy

    poopy

    Location:
    SoCal
    Driving:
    UberX
  4. Michael - Cleveland

    Michael - Cleveland Moderator

    Location:
    Great Lakes
    Driving:
    UberSELECT
    Everything you suggest is POSSIBLE -
    but far from being "Facts about being treated as employees"
     
  5. MarkR

    MarkR

    Location:
    Parlin, NJ
    Driving:
    UberX
    WHEN IS THIS GOING TO HAPPEN IN NJ? I want to be in the courtroom that day!
     
  6. Sacto Burbs

    Sacto Burbs

    Location:
    SF Peninsula
    Driving:
    UberX
    You don't get it. We WANT to be REAL independent contractors. No deactivation for bad ratings, no more say "tips are not necessary" no more being forced to unwitting take a $4 ride - for $2.40 net - and most importantly SETTING OUR OWN RATES. Uber has you brainwashed, bucko. Their curent way is ILLEGAL. We have 100 years of labour laws here to protect people. And so do you down under ...
     
    tootsie, pizza guy, observer and 7 others like this.
  7. MarkR

    MarkR

    Location:
    Parlin, NJ
    Driving:
    UberX
    They break a lot of laws currently.
    1) WE ARE EMPLOYEES!! - they provide insurance and have policies on us.
    2) THEY TELL US WE HAVE TO DO THINGS A CERTAIN WAY- bull****! My business, my way. I'll continue paying a 20% royalty for use of the app. YES! Royalty! What we pay is a licensing fee. SHARK TANK WOULD PROBABLY TELL YOU THE SAME THING.
    3) THEY LIE TO CUSTOMERS - I tell riders enjoy the app, they break laws, enjoy it while it's still here.
     
  8. UberHammer

    UberHammer

    Location:
    Between the saw and nails
    Driving:
    UberSELECT
    Uber will never take on drivers as employees.

    The government calling out Uber for treating drivers as employees will push Uber towards actually treating drivers as independent contractors.
     
  9. MarkR

    MarkR

    Location:
    Parlin, NJ
    Driving:
    UberX
    We already are employees. THEY HAVE INSURANCE ON US, they also dictate who we have to take, what tips??, our management does not allow tipping.

    WE ARE EMPLOYEES - TREATED AS ILLIGALS - WE WORK FOR THEM BUT NOT REALLY. Lol enjoy now they may disappear. They do treat us like employees.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2015
    20yearsdriving likes this.
  10. UberHammer

    UberHammer

    Location:
    Between the saw and nails
    Driving:
    UberSELECT
    That's the point. Since Uber is treating drivers like employees, then either Uber starts ponying up for the burdens employees are legally responsible for, or Uber stops treating drivers like employees. There is 0.0001% chance Uber ponies up to the legal burdens of being an employer, and 99.9999% chance it forces Uber to stop treating drivers like employees. I can't for the life of me understand why drivers want the status quo.
     
  11. UberNorthStar

    UberNorthStar

    Location:
    Southern Burbs of Houston
    Driving:
    UberX
    What do you think the Safe Rider Fees (driver & rider are charged) go to pay? Insurance! Uber does not give us anything.

    A Well-Known Member is welcome to correct me should I be wrong.
     
    TwoFiddyMile likes this.
  12. MarkR

    MarkR

    Location:
    Parlin, NJ
    Driving:
    UberX
    I have no idea either. They want it both ways! You can't have a business and NOT have the tax liabilty. NJ should wake up and either get UBER out of the state or give us our W4 to fill out so we can have the taxes taken out. In the mean time, UBER should stop telling pax not to tip as I don't work for UBER and that's what EMPLOYERS DO!
     
    NH_Uber_Driver likes this.
  13. glados

    glados

    Location:
    .
    If Uber lost in court, it would reduce pax usage, and result in lower earnings for drivers.

    Do you REALLY want Uber to be unable to deactivate someone who made unwanted sexual advances on a pax, borderlining on rape but not enough for a criminal prosecution? Will that pax still use Uber?

    Do you REALLY want Uber to be unable to deactivate drivers who take 30 mile "scenic routes" instead of the shortest 10 mile route? Will that pax still use Uber if they are unable to get a fare adjustment?

    Uber makes money only when you make money. The incentives are currently aligned, but if lawyers get their way it won't benefit partners -- only them.
     
  14. UberNorthStar

    UberNorthStar

    Location:
    Southern Burbs of Houston
    Driving:
    UberX
    Partners??? (Yes, this is a C&P of another post of UNS)

    If Uber (U) had an agreement with its ICs that was not so one-sided, we would not be witching!

    1. Allow us to be represented as a group by an outside agency to be sure the agreement is in the ICs' best interest. U has its lawyers for its representation.
    2. No discouraging of tipping by U in any way, shape, or form. To reverse previous messages to pax, U will put a statement on rider's app that "Tip is not included.".
    3. Rates/fees per mile/min are to be set no less than 75% of the average local major taxi cab companies in each city.
    4. U drops its commission to no more than 15% on all platforms. No more raising commissionson for high platforms to make up for low rates on X & XL platforms.
    5. If U keeps commission at 20%, U is to pay each driver 18¢ per mile on the # of miles clocked on each driver's pay period while driving to pax until pax is at destination or trip is ended to pay 1/2 the cost of running a car.
    5. ICs will not be limited to driving just on U app. IC's outside legal business is of no concern to U.
    6. Ratings on drivers will cease. If a rider has a comment on a rider, U will provide a B.I.T.C.H. link for such.
    B-eautiful
    I-ntelligent
    T-alented
    C-harming
    H-elpful

    No comments? The driver is good to go. :)
     
    tootsie and stuber like this.
  15. glados

    glados

    Location:
    .
    There would be no Uber if it operated under these abhorrent terms. With no ratings system, Uber will not be able to detect and deactivate drivers for serious incidents and riders will stop riding Uber due to the poor experience.

    Uber's commission covers variable expenses including the cost of payments processing, fraud, automated dispatching, driver and rider support, and much more. Uber is a low margin business.

    And finally... one of the reasons many riders use Uber is because there is no tipping. Increased riders = more rides for drivers = more $$$. It's the same philosophy between the rate cuts that Uber does with a lot of data and testing -- Uber has reversed rate cuts in many markets according to data.
     
  16. UberNorthStar

    UberNorthStar

    Location:
    Southern Burbs of Houston
    Driving:
    UberX
    Drivers can make only so many runs per hour.

    By adding a comment link riders can express their displeasure with a ride instead of using a numerical range of numbers which do not say "why."
     
    NH_Uber_Driver, stuber and DriverX like this.
  17. glados

    glados

    Location:
    .
    That's where Perpetual Rides comes in. Eventually drivers may be on a paid trip 100% of the time, picking up and dropping pax along the way.

    It is simply unfeasible to pay someone to review every single comment by a rider when they say something like "Thanks for the ride", etc. A stars ratings system have been shown in studies to be scientifically accurate with large sample sizes.
     
  18. Michael - Cleveland

    Michael - Cleveland Moderator

    Location:
    Great Lakes
    Driving:
    UberSELECT
    That's an opinion about a hypothetical. Not fact.

    That is nonsense.
    Uber can still 'deactivate' an IC or 'fire' an employee for inappropriate conduct. But if we are ICs, they can't THREATEN us with deactivation for a low acceptance rate (since we're supposed to be able to chose only the ride requests we want) and they can't threaten us over poor ratings that are provided to us anonymously, over things which we have no control - and are often the result of Uber's actions (like Surge Pricing).

    That is a flat out falsehood.
    Uber makes money EVERY SINGLE TIME I GIVE A RIDE - whether I make money on the ride or lose money on the ride.
    Uber makes money REGARDLESS of whether or not I make money.

    No they're not. The incentives encourage more and shorter rides per hour because THAT is what is more profitable to Uber... not the driver.
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2015
    arto71, observer, Huberis and 6 others like this.
  19. MarkR

    MarkR

    Location:
    Parlin, NJ
    Driving:
    UberX
    HAHAHAHA... You put a lot more time into this than I would
     
    Lack9133 and Michael - Cleveland like this.
  20. glados

    glados

    Location:
    .
    A lower passenger experience will result in less rides, which means less earnings for partners.

    By declining a significant number of rides, you are making the system unreliable as further away drivers must pick them up.

    Think about it like this: Do you think Uber should let someone who times out _every single request_, increasing request ETAs and making the system unreliable? If so, should Uber deactivate someone who deactivates 99%? 98%? etc.

    Uber is within the legal framework by deactivating drivers that severely impacts its operations, and that's exactly what Uber is doing. Drivers do have the right to only accept the requests they want.

    This is a logical fallacy. If you are not making money driving for Uber, then you should sign up for another Uber service (e.g. UberSELECT), or stop driving for Uber. As only drivers making a profit should be driving for Uber, Uber will only make money when drivers make money.
     
    MarkR likes this.

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