Uber..gst and employees

Daz

Member
Does this ruling in the US have any bearing on Australian drivers. I still believe gst should be collected from the employer. Uber. Not the employee. We will see in the future how this pans out.


SUV warriorNew Member
Drivers who worked for ride-hailing service Uber [UBER.UL] in California and Massachusetts over the past seven years would have been entitled to an estimated $730 million in expense reimbursements had they been employees rather than contractors, according to court documents made public on Monday.

Uber and smaller rival Lyft are attempting to settle lawsuits by drivers who contend they should be classified as employees and therefore entitled to reimbursement for expenses, including gasoline and vehicle maintenance. Drivers currently pay those costs themselves.

According to attorneys for Uber drivers, the total potential damages in the case are $852 million, when including a claim to recover tips. The figure is based on rates for mileage reimbursement set by the U.S. government and on data provided by Uber Technologies Inc.

The company, meanwhile, calculates damages at $429 million, mainly due to a lower mileage rate.

The figures had been redacted in the original settlement deal proposed last month, but a San Francisco federal judge ordered them unsealed. The new data reveals how much of a risk employee classification is for on-demand tech companies like Uber. The proposed $100 million settlement keeps Uber drivers classified as contractors, though U.S. regulators are still reviewing the issue.

Uber drivers in California and Massachusetts were entitled to about $122 million in tips, the filings show. That means Uber made about $732 million in commissions in those two states since 2009, based on an assumed 20 percent tip rate - more than $100 million less than it would have cost to reimburse drivers for expenses and tips.

An Uber representative declined to comment.

The judge must decide whether the $100 million Uber settlement is fair, and the total potential damages at play will likely bear on his analysis. The deal represents about 12 percent of the potential $852 million in damages.

Lyft had agreed to settle its class action for $12.25 million, but a separate federal judge rejected the deal because it represented only about 9 percent of the value of drivers' claims.

While the deal does not elevate drivers to employees, attorneys for drivers have defended it, saying they faced significant risks had the case gone to trial. They also say drivers who have worked several months could be entitled to thousands of dollars each under the settlement.

Beyond the money, Uber also agreed to new policies including an appeals process for drivers terminated by Uber.
 

Phildo

Well-Known Member
Does this ruling in the US have any bearing on Australian drivers.
Nup, zero. Completely different legal systems.

I still believe gst should be collected from the employer. Uber. Not the employee. We will see in the future how this pans out.
Uber isn't an employer, it is a taxi dispatch service. That's covered by WA legislation.
 
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UbeRay

Active Member
We use Ubers system to their requirements and transport our passengers.
We technically charge Uber for the full fare which includes the total GST. "Trip Earnings"
So instead of creating an invoice for each individual rider we create one total invoice to Uber which is as per their Payment Statement "Trip Earnings".
Uber has collected all of our trip earnings and remit to us the balance less their percentage.
I raise a payment in my books for the Uber Fee without any GST that equals their percentage.
This ensures I remit the total GST for all Trip Earnings to the ATO and leaves my books square.
We are definately not employees. Concur with GG and Phildo
 

Delusion

New Member
Here is a good website that specialise in Tax for Uber Drivers ... drivetax .. add the usual front and end Internet address as I can't post the link.
In that website are some examples and explanations on how to work out the GST.
 

Molotov

New Member
Here is a good website that specialise in Tax for Uber Drivers ... drivetax .. add the usual front and end Internet address as I can't post the link.
In that website are some examples and explanations on how to work out the GST.
That's a very good site, very informative. Cheers!
 

UberDriverAU

Well-Known Member
Nup, zero. Completely different legal systems.



Uber isn't an employer, it is a taxi dispatch service. That's covered by WA legislation.
There's absolutely nothing in any WA legislation that precludes a finding that Uber is legally an employer. A TDS can most certainly be an employer of drivers.

We use Ubers system to their requirements and transport our passengers.
Uber accrues nearly 100% of the goodwill associated with "our passengers". That's a good sign that they're not actually our passengers after all.

We technically charge Uber for the full fare which includes the total GST. "Trip Earnings"
So instead of creating an invoice for each individual rider we create one total invoice to Uber which is as per their Payment Statement "Trip Earnings".
Uber has collected all of our trip earnings and remit to us the balance less their percentage.
I raise a payment in my books for the Uber Fee without any GST that equals their percentage.
This ensures I remit the total GST for all Trip Earnings to the ATO and leaves my books square.
We are definately not employees. Concur with GG and Phildo
The ATO's own employee/contractor decision tool suggests that we are indeed employees. The fact that we have ABNs, collect GST, etc, isn't that relevant in determining whether or not a worker is legally an employee or contractor. Whether or not we are able to delegate the work (no, we can't, Uber prohibits this and can deactivate us for doing so), and whether or not we work in Uber's business or our own (most likely in Uber's business if we're doing UberX) are more relevant factors in answering this legal question. It most certainly isn't a "definitely not". Based on the research that I've done (that involves reading actual judgements from court cases on this very topic, rather than anonymous posts on a driver's forum), I'm certainly leaning towards a finding of employee for most drivers once this question actually gets asked in court.
 

UberDriverAU

Well-Known Member
While the deal does not elevate drivers to employees, attorneys for drivers have defended it, saying they faced significant risks had the case gone to trial. They also say drivers who have worked several months could be entitled to thousands of dollars each under the settlement.

Beyond the money, Uber also agreed to new policies including an appeals process for drivers terminated by Uber.
This settlement hasn't actually been approved by the court yet to my knowledge. It does not, and can not, prevent future drivers or those not in this particular class action from suing Uber for worker misclassification.
 

Kiwitrains

Active Member
There's absolutely nothing in any WA legislation that precludes a finding that Uber is legally an employer. A TDS can most certainly be an employer of drivers.


Uber accrues nearly 100% of the goodwill associated with "our passengers". That's a good sign that they're not actually our passengers after all.


The ATO's own employee/contractor decision tool suggests that we are indeed employees. The fact that we have ABNs, collect GST, etc, isn't that relevant in determining whether or not a worker is legally an employee or contractor. Whether or not we are able to delegate the work (no, we can't, Uber prohibits this and can deactivate us for doing so), and whether or not we work in Uber's business or our own (most likely in Uber's business if we're doing UberX) are more relevant factors in answering this legal question. It most certainly isn't a "definitely not". Based on the research that I've done (that involves reading actual judgements from court cases on this very topic, rather than anonymous posts on a driver's forum), I'm certainly leaning towards a finding of employee for most drivers once this question actually gets asked in court.
Do Uber issue end of year details to drivers?
 

Hillsy

New Member
Under the ATO rules for employee, if Uber is your full time job, under the 80% rule for contracting to an entity, you are classified by the ATO to be an employee. Interesting that.
 

Gazza1953

Member
Under the ATO rules for employee, if Uber is your full time job, under the 80% rule for contracting to an entity, you are classified by the ATO to be an employee. Interesting that.
Uber is not a company registered in Australia and driving for Uber is not a job.
 
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