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The Christian Driver's thread

The Christian driver

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  • #481
a) I have interest in alcohol but I don't drink and drive. That doesn't mean DUI law means nothing. That's not how it works. The laws are there regardless of whether you break the law or not.

b) "When genuine Christians die, we become perfect as God is perfect." And who evaluates whether someone is a "genuine Christian"? That wouldn't the person we send the $100/week to, would it?

c) What about people who have never been exposed to Christianity? Remote tribes and such. Or people in other parts of the world throughout history. Or people who lived before the days of JC? None of them were or are allowed everlasting life? Why would God fail to inform these people of the opportunity?

d) Not sure how this one is an actual response to what I said.

e) Ah. So God likes cheerful givers. But what about the even more cheerful takers from those givers? So, if I can corral 100,000 cheerful givers into cheerfully giving me $100/week each... let's see... that's a cool $10 mil a week. So, God will be perfectly happy when I purchase my spanking brand new Gulfstream X? Isn't debt a sin too? So, he'll be okay if I just pay all cash up front for the Gulfstream? And what about if I spend most of the year on an extended vacation visiting all the extra homes I've been buying with that money? I'll also be paying cash for those. Is he going to expect me to preach or can I just occasionally give him a wave and say, "I'm still believin' in ya, bro!" And it's all tax free too, right?

I mean, if all this is correct, heck! Sign me up! I get to be a perfectly horrible human being, take millions from poor people, live a lifestyle of the rich and famous... AND I get the live forever.

Damn.
A) I am trying to make a point. The law is still there, but when you become true Christian, you are not under the law but under grace. If the speed limit is 70 and you are person that don't like driving fast, you aren't worried about breaking the law because you are in agreement with the law. The person who is lawless always going 90miles/hr is the one worried.

B) God knows genuine Christians. But when one is born again, he receives the holy spirit. The holy spirit dwells in every true believer. The same spirit that raised Jesus up from the dead. Gods spirit witnesses with our spirit that we are the children of God. We don't become perfect on our own. God makes us perfect.

C) A person doesn't go to hell because he has not heard the gospel. He goes to hell because he is a sinner. All of us have sinned against our creator. Now there are levels of hell just like there are levels of sin. Unless you come to believe in Jesus Christ, your punishment will be way way worse than the person that never heard the gospel. At this point, you are trampling underfoot the son of the living God and calling his blood an unclean thing..

The people before Christ are saved the same way the people are saved now. The lamb was slain before the foundation of the world. They looked forward to the coming messiah and believed. The bible from Genesis to the revelation is all about Jesus Christ. "Lo I come in the volume of the book, it is written of me." All the sacrifices, rituals, the law, Noah's Ark, Jonah and the whale.. and so many others were pictures, pictures, pictures of the coming messiah...

D) No when you truly believe you cannot do whatever, because you are not the same person you were before. The apostle Paul has made that clear in Roman's 6. "Shall we continue in sin so grace might abound, by no means. How can we who are dead to sin still live in it?" Genuine born again Christians are given new nature. A Nature that wants to please God. We still sin, but we dont live in sin..

E) if you are truly born again Christian, you read your bible daily. You eventually will discern the fake. Above all, you have the holy spirit that dwells in you directing your steps.

In most cases, The people that are victims of the false TV Pastors are not victims. They want the same thing their Pastor wants. These people have itching ears that accumilate teachers to tell them what they want to hear. They dont want God but only the blessings that come from God. They want to hear how God is going to get them house, money, marriage all the temporal vanity..
 
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Another Uber Driver

Well-Known Member
Moderator
who evaluates whether someone is a "genuine Christian"? That wouldn't the person we send the $100/week to, would it?
Those charlatans think that they do.

c) What about people who have never been exposed to Christianity? Remote tribes and such. Or people in other parts of the world throughout history. Or people who lived before the days of JC? None of them were or are allowed everlasting life? Why would God fail to inform these people of the opportunity?
It depends on whom you ask. The Catholics and the Orthodox actually allow for the possibility of non-Christians in Paradise. It is a corollary of what George Carlin expressed as "Ya' hafta' wanna'"


Zoroaster is the true god.
Zoroaster was the prophet. Their creator god was Ahura Mazda, the Lord of Light.

I still talk to Athena from time to time when Zoro isn't looking, as she was the god they worshiped in the town my Greek ancestors are from. She's pretty cool
.........then you are not supposed to be worshipping τόν τών βαρβαρών θεόν ...............................

Athena was one of the few female divinities that the ancient Greeks liked. They did not like Hera, they were not crazy about Artemis and they had mixed feelings about Aphrodite. Yes, the last one was beautiful, sexy and all that, but, she was also sneaky, tricky and could lead you to ruin.

The cult of Mithras, derived from Zoroastiranism, was popular among Roman soldiers from the time of Julius Caesar until about the death of Diocletian (A.D. 305), by which time Christianity became far more popular in the Roman army. Eight years subsequent to the death of Diocletian, Constantine would issue the Edict of Mediolanum, which would decree that Christianity would be tolerated in the Roman Empire.
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We still sin, but we dont live in sin..
A Baptist preacher once put it to me this way: You will commit sins, but you can not live a life marked by sin. That is and was the best explanation that I have heard of it.


.....even if I am Catholic, I still respect true Men of God...........................and believe that I can learn from them..............
 

The Christian driver

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  • #483
A Baptist preacher once put it to me this way: You will commit sins, but you can not live a life marked by sin. That is and was the best explanation that I have heard of it.


.....even if I am Catholic, I still respect true Men of God...........................and believe that I can learn from them..............
Yes that is good explanation. In every false so called Christian churchs, there are always remnant that God saves.. you could be one of them that God will snatch with outstretched and mighty hand like he did the Israelites from Egypt.
 

treesweets dancer

Well-Known Member
Zoroaster was the prophet. Their creator god was Ahura Mazda, the Lord of Light.
Are u denigrating my beliefs? I mean jews & muslims say the same about Jesus but we're supposed to respect the beliefs of those who say differently.
Athena was one of the few female divinities that the ancient Greeks liked.
That's why I picked her too. Most of those greek gods were total DBags. Athena seemed sincerely into justice for its own sake. Hera is a gd @@@@@, a great match for that not too bright husband.

& Kudos for having enuf sense of humor to make this thread. At first I thought u just wiped it out, which technically is a mod duty, keeping it on topic, but joykilling nonetheless. Then I was confused at how there were still notifications for the off topic replies. Then I saw the thread title. Nice. This thread is hilarious
 

dragnet

Well-Known Member
A) I am trying to make a point. The law is still there, but when you become true Christian, you are not under the law but under grace. If the speed limit is 70 and you are person that don't like driving fast, you aren't worried about breaking the law because you are in agreement with the law. The person who is lawless always going 90miles/hr is the one worried.

B) God knows genuine Christians. But when one is born again, he receives the holy spirit. The holy spirit dwells in every true believer. The same spirit that raised Jesus up from the dead. Gods spirit witnesses with our spirit that we are the children of God. We don't become perfect on our own. God makes us perfect.

C) A person doesn't go to hell because he has not heard the gospel. He goes to hell because he is a sinner. All of us have sinned against our creator. Now there are levels of hell just like there are levels of sin. Unless you come to believe in Jesus Christ, your punishment will be way way worse than the person that never heard the gospel. At this point, you are trampling underfoot the son of the living God and calling his blood an unclean thing..

The people before Christ are saved the same way the people are saved now. The lamb was slain before the foundation of the world. They looked forward to the coming messiah and believed. The bible from Genesis to the revelation is all about Jesus Christ. "Lo I come in the volume of the book, it is written of me." All the sacrifices, rituals, the law, Noah's Ark, Jonah and the whale.. and so many others were pictures, pictures, pictures of the coming messiah...

D) No when you truly believe you cannot do whatever, because you are not the same person you were before. The apostle Paul has made that clear in Roman's 6. "Shall we continue in sin so grace might abound, by no means. How can we who are dead to sin still live in it?" Genuine born again Christians are given new nature. A Nature that wants to please God. We still sin, but we dont live in sin..

E) if you are truly born again Christian, you read your bible daily. You eventually will discern the fake. Above all, you have the holy spirit that dwells in you directing your steps.

In most cases, The people that are victims of the false TV Pastors are not victims. They want the same thing their Pastor wants. These people have itching ears that accumilate teachers to tell them what they want to hear. They dont want God but only the blessings that come from God. They want to hear how God is going to get them house, money, marriage all the temporal vanity..
So, why doesn't God just make himself President of the world? He's all powerful. He can easily doing a few clearly provable miracles and be done with all the confusion and questioning. We'd all just bow down knowing he's the real deal. Seems pretty simple.

Look, everything I've seen in my lifetime that is honestly, genuinely amazing has come from science and engineering. Whereas religion has a long rap sheet of killing and cheating. The "miracles" I see coming from science are always presented to me in ways that I can confirm them. You can read papers. You can check the math. All the "miracles" claimed by religion are never confirmed. It just is cuz people say it is. That's not enough for me.

Come up with something substantive and then we can have a legitimate conversation about religion. Until then all I see is the imaginary work of ancient sheep herders.
 

treesweets dancer

Well-Known Member
Sokrates thought that a tornado was the chief god
What a troll. I love questioning people's unfounded assumptions until they get pissed. It's not a thing to be proud of, but it's who I am. Asura Mazda made me that way.

Are we certain Socrates didn't tell him that, sorta like a smartass atheist will bring up the spaghetti monster. & maybe that other guy didn't sense the irony in his voice? We'll never know. We get all this info totally put of the social context. & there's was an oral, not written culture. It'd be awesome to have a time machine & talk to these guys about their writings that we have.

Socrates be like "haha, you guys know about that tornado thing? I was just drunk & having a good time, just wanted to see how he'd react if I said that. Really, a tornado represents chaos taking down our structures, so it was sorta dissing all their theories with my tornado is The God idea. I knew writing was gonna be a bad invention."
"Well actually Socrates, writing helped us eventually fly to the moon, so.... It also helped people spread the idea that the Earth is flat. I guess it's good & it's bad."
 

The Christian driver

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What a troll. I love questioning people's unfounded assumptions until they get pissed. It's not a thing to be proud of, but it's who I am. Asura Mazda made me that way.

Are we certain Socrates didn't tell him that, sorta like a smartass atheist will bring up the spaghetti monster. & maybe that other guy didn't sense the irony in his voice? We'll never know. We get all this info totally put of the social context. & there's was an oral, not written culture. It'd be awesome to have a time machine & talk to these guys about their writings that we have.

Socrates be like "haha, you guys know about that tornado thing? I was just drunk & having a good time, just wanted to see how he'd react if I said that. Really, a tornado represents chaos taking down our structures, so it was sorta dissing all their theories with my tornado is The God idea. I knew writing was gonna be a bad invention."
"Well actually Socrates, writing helped us eventually fly to the moon, so.... It also helped people spread the idea that the Earth is flat. I guess it's good & it's bad."
Man by his wisdom cannot know the true and living God. He creates false non existent small gods in his wicked imagination. All are fraud false small gods that have no existence. They all lead to one place call the bottomless pit.. pit that has no bottom.. you will be falling and falling and falling.. You are on the way to hell. Turn from your idolatry and believe in the only creator that created you. Today is the day of Salvation. Tomorrow is not promised. Unending destruction and infinite misery is ahead unless you turn from your sins and put your trust in Jesus Christ. He is the only saviour that bore the sins of the world and died. Jesus Christ forever defeated sin and death. He resurrected on the third day. He holds the key to heaven and hell. He is the resurrection and the life. He has promised eternal life to all that believe in his name.
 

dragnet

Well-Known Member
Man by his wisdom cannot know the true and living God.
...which is a completely absurd statement. There is no meaning in those words. Zero. It's just empty rhetoric designed to convince people of something that doesn't exist.
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He has promised eternal life to all that believe in his name.
So, if he is all powerful he can certainly send some emissaries to give us some verifiable proof that this it true. No hand waving. No empty words. Come and do something really significant. Turn Half Dome in Yosemite upside down. Cure all birth defects for all time. These should be easy and then everyone will know.
 

Another Uber Driver

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Are u denigrating my beliefs?
......nothing of the kind. That was a simple statement on a basic tenet of Zorastrianism.

I mean jews & muslims say the same about Jesus but we're supposed to respect the beliefs of those who say differently.

That's why I picked her too. Most of those greek gods were total DBags. Athena seemed sincerely into justice for its own sake. Hera is a gd @@@@@, a great match for that not too bright husband.

& Kudos for having enuf sense of humor to make this thread. At first I thought u just wiped it out, which technically is a mod duty, keeping it on topic, but joykilling nonetheless.
For future reference, we do not discuss moderation actions, or lack thereof in open forum. The only exception is on the UP Board on the "Hangout" Boards. I have my reasons for allowing your post, although I will not be so tolerant in the future.

This is the "Chatter" or "Off Topic" Board. Posts and topics of this nature are allowed. Some have objected to allowing this topic, due to its nature and that its content is something that they find objectionable. These are people from that element of our society who advocate for the suppression of anything with which they disagree. They honestly believe that everyone is entitled to his opinion, as l ong as it agrees with theirs. It is part of the "respect" and "tolerance" for which that element is oh-so-well-known.



What a troll
.

Moderator bashing, be it in open forum or PM is not allowed ,either. As I am assuming that this remark is strictly tongue-in-cheek, I am allowing it to stand.


Asura Mazda made me that way
Ahura Mazda, not "Asura"..

Are we certain Socrates didn't tell him that, sorta like a smartass atheist will bring up the spaghetti monster. & maybe that other guy didn't sense the irony in his voice?

Aristophanes was playing on a popular conception of Sokrates' beliefs and teachings. Other than what Plato puts into Sokrates' mouth, we know very little about what he actually said. Xenophon has some comments. Aristotle makes some, as well. There are marginal notes to ancient works called "scholia" where the scholiast refers to an ancient work that has perished, but, other than Plato, Xenophon or Aristotle, very little is known about what Sokrates actually said or taught. Sokrates was tried, found guilty and put to death for "Corrupting the Youth". One of the charges levelled against him was that he did not believe in the Greek gods.
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there are always remnant that God saves..
Please do not tell me that you are a Jehova's Witness. If so, get out your Gospel of John. We have a matter to discuss.
 
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The Christian driver

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......nothing of the kind. That was a simple statement on a basic tenet of Zorastrianism.

I mean jews & muslims say the same about Jesus but we're supposed to respect the beliefs of those who say differently.

That's why I picked her too. Most of those greek gods were total DBags. Athena seemed sincerely into justice for its own sake. Hera is a gd @@@@@, a great match for that not too bright husband.



For future reference, we do not discuss moderation actions, or lack thereof in open forum. The only exception is on the UP Board on the "Hangout" Boards. I have my reasons for allowing your post, although I will not be so tolerant in the future.

This is the "Chatter" or "Off Topic" Board. Posts and topics of this nature are allowed. Some have objected to allowing this topic, due to its nature and that its content is something that they find objectionable. These are people from that element of our society who advocate for the suppression of anything with which they disagree. They honestly believe that everyone is entitled to his opinion, as l ong as it agrees with theirs. It is part of the "respect" and "tolerance" for which that element is oh-so-well-known.



.

Moderator bashing, be it in open forum or PM is not allowed ,either. As I am assuming that this remark is strictly tongue-in-cheek, I am allowing it to stand.




Ahura Mazda, not "Asura"..




Aristophanes was playing on a popular conception of Sokrates' beliefs and teachings. Other than what Plato puts into Sokrates' mouth, we know very little about what he actually said. Xenophon has some comments. Aristotle makes some, as well. There are marginal notes to ancient works called "scholia" where the scholiast refers to an ancient work that has perished, but, other than Plato, Xenophon or Aristotle, very little is known about what Sokrates actually said or taught. Sokrates was tried, found guilty and put to death for "Corrupting the Youth". One of the charges levelled against him was that he did not believe in the Greek gods.
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Please do not tell me that you are a Jehova's Witness. If so, get out your Gospel of John. We have a matter to discuss.
You know I am not.. far far from it. You cannot be student of the John Macarthur, RC Sproul, Charles Spurgeon and all other sound expository teachers and not be able to discern. Not to mention, my local church known in the bay area to be radical about Jesus Christ.
 

Another Uber Driver

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Moderator
You know I am not.. far far from it.

.........Yes, I know.........tongue-in-cheek remark..........................."Remnant" plus "saved" sounds like Jehova's Witness talk......................If you never have read the Watchtower translation of the Bible, take a peek at their Gospel of John, Verse One. The Watchtower renders it as "The Word was a God" This implies polytheism. I always ask them about that. They never seem to have an answer, except "We have our scholars..............." Allright, you have your "scholars" but I can read the Greek, as well, and I am not seeing where they get the indefinite article here. While it is true that Classical and Koine Greek lack an indefinite article, still, I can see no call for inserting it here.
 

treesweets dancer

Well-Known Member
nothing of the kind. That was a simple statement on a basic tenet of Zorastrianism
I know u were just letting me know a fact. My "denigrated belief" was a joke. This is what followed:
I mean jews & muslims say the same about Jesus but we're supposed to respect the beliefs of those who say differently
I was playing the analog of a christian being told by a Jew, Jesus was just a prophet & yaweh was the actual god.
Moderator bashing, be it in open forum or PM is not allowed ,either. As I am assuming that this remark is strictly tongue-in-cheek, I am allowing it to stand
No. "What a troll" was about Socrates telling that guy a tornado is the chief god, see:
Are we certain Socrates didn't tell him that, sorta like a smartass atheist will bring up the spaghetti monster. & maybe that other guy didn't sense the irony in his voice? We'll never know. We get all this info totally out of the social context. & their's was an oral, not written culture. It'd be awesome to have a time machine & talk to these guys about their writings that we have.
Like possibly Socrates was trolling that guy. & now he's got it written down millenia later, that he believes a tornado is chief god. I've always imagined him having a George Carlin or Mark Twain sorta personality. He may have even just wanted to see if that guy would believe he really believed it.

I was just having fun. Not actually trying to offend someone over fictional characters from ancient literature.

I was already aware that we know little of Socrates. That's why I think it's plausible he could have been jesting with statements like that, but allowing people to believe he meant it. The ancient writings come across as serious, but these guys were people like us. Irony isn't new.

For future reference, we do not discuss moderation actions, or lack thereof in open forum
Sorry. I was just trying to say that was cool of you, & yr effort was appreciated.
 

Another Uber Driver

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Moderator
Sorry. I was just trying to say that was cool of you, & yr effort was appreciated.

I actually took it that way, which was why I let it stand. The apology is not necessary. The remark was meant more to advise you to beware lest another Moderator see it and he might not be as understanding or tolerant as I am. Perhaps I could have phrased it better.
 

The Christian driver

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.........Yes, I know.........tongue-in-cheek remark..........................."Remnant" plus "saved" sounds like Jehova's Witness talk......................If you never have read the Watchtower translation of the Bible, take a peek at their Gospel of John, Verse One. The Watchtower renders it as "The Word was a God" This implies polytheism. I always ask them about that. They never seem to have an answer, except "We have our scholars..............." Allright, you have your "scholars" but I can read the Greek, as well, and I am not seeing where they get the indefinite article here. While it is true that Classical and Koine Greek lack an indefinite article, still, I can see no call for inserting it here.
Oh yes I know they change that one specific verse. That is always the work of the devil. And I never see them being persecuted or even mocked.. if you try to street preach and mention Sin, righteousness and judgment. If you say Jesus is the only way instead of a way, it is very likely police will be called on you.
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So, why doesn't God just make himself President of the world? He's all powerful. He can easily doing a few clearly provable miracles and be done with all the confusion and questioning. We'd all just bow down knowing he's the real deal. Seems pretty simple.
God is not like anything you see here. God does not need anything from us. The bible says we are just like the grass in the eyes of God. He is the only king. We don't vote, elect or anything as such. He created everything. Everything is his. Even the devil is his. Everything that happens in this world, doesnt happen outside of his sovereign will. God is.. God is.. God is.... believing in God is a gift, bowing down before him is honor.. knowing him is honor.. Jesus Christ came to earth and showed many miracles and ressurected from the dead. Many didn't believe. Why? Again faith is a gift.. you cannot come to the infinite God that created this universe, who has no beginning, the only wise, highest supreme judge, you cannot come to him proud. God resists the proud, but gives grace to the humble. He will hide his face from you more and more... humble yourself, get on your face before your maker cry out to him, confessing your sins until he saves you. Pray psalms 51..
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I actually took it that way, which was why I let it stand. The apology is not necessary. The remark was meant more to advise you to beware lest another Moderator see it and he might not be as understanding or tolerant as I am. Perhaps I could have phrased it better.
Do you have the grace to you app.. I believe John Macarthur has over thousand messages on there free. That is amazing. Decades and decades of one mans labor, we get to listen to it free.. I strongly recommend it. Those messages are water to the soul. True spirit filled messages.
 
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Another Uber Driver

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Moderator
Oh yes I know they change that one specific verse.
...................and while there are several things about it that annoy me, I do wish that one of them would actually come out and tell me from WHERE they get this...........if for no other reason than just to satisfy my scholarly curiosity. I do, of course, have other reasons for wanting to know from where they get this, but, that one is among them..................................


And I never see them being persecuted or even mocked.
.

I have seen the Jehova's Witnesses mocked in several places, including here. Never have I seen anyone physically attack them or destroy the literature stands that they have, but, I have seen people who made fun of them.


if you try to street preach and mention Sin, righteousness and judgment. If you say Jesus is the only way instead of a way, it is very likely police will be called on you.
Do they do that in SF? When you consider that for which some of those people advocate on street corners out there, you would think that the Christians would be the least of the City Officials' worries. This passes over some of the real problems in SF other than what the street speakers proclaim.

I would hope that the police would inform the people who call them that the Christian has just as much right to advocate for his cause as do the other speakers out there............but then, SF is run by what runs it. More than a few of those people do believe that you are entitled to your opinion as long as it conforms to the "Generally Approved and Accepted" opinion(s).

There was something on YouTube about a girl who was testifying before the Raleigh, North Carolina City Council. She was asking them to ban abortion within the city. About halfway through her testimony, people began to try to shout her down. She boldly continued with the firmest of resolve. The Chairman did finally call for order and tried several times to remind the audience that the little girl had the right to make her statements and that they had to come to order and let her speak.

It stopped while he was still calling for order. If he did say anything about the City Council's being unable to reverse a U.S. Supreme Court decision, it is not there. The Chair was simply trying to make the point that the girl had the right to make known her opinions and requests, and that people should respect that right.



Do you have the grace to you app..

I have heard of it, but, do not know much about it. I shall have to look into it.
 

The Christian driver

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Just something for the preacher to think about.

Believing in Jesus is faith on the cleansing of all sins through his blood. Consequently, accepting that He forgives us all, regardless of the sin.
So when the preacher says that a non believer will burn, this contradict the basis of his faith.
Very good point. The sin of unbelief is the only sin that cannot be forgiven. It is an eternal sin. The holy spirit is the only way a sinner is able to come to faith in the glorious gospel of Jesus Christ. Blaspheming the spirit of the living God leads to an eternal death.
Matthew 12:31,32

"Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come."
 
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Another Uber Driver

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Moderator
The sin of unbelief is the only sin that cannot be forgiven. It is an eternal sin. The holy spirit is the only way a sinner is able to come to faith in the glorious gospel of Jesus Christ. Blaspheming the spirit of the living God leads to an eternal death.
This is not dissimilar from how a priest explained it to me. As he put it, rejecting the Gospel is rejecting the Holy Spirit which constitutes blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. You can reject the Gospel several times throughout your life, but, as long as you accept it eventually, you are not culpable for that blasphemy. It is when you reject if for all time, that is, if you die having always rejected the Gospel and never accepting it, then, you have committed the blasphemy for which you will suffer the designated penalty.

The poster that you quoted seems to be arguing from the Unitarian Universalist point of view. Many of them believe that the sacrifice of Christ was necessary, but, no man shall be condemned to hell; all will be reconciled with God. Oddly enough, while some of its tenets have their roots in Arianism, others have their roots in New England Puritanism.
 
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