Low Skill Job? PFFFT!!! Not Even

Alsace Struggle

Well-Known Member
Ever heard of Google maps? That basically destroyed the importantance of local street knowledge. Now any idiot with a four door car and no training can put on Google maps or Waze and more or less get the person close to their destination. Still an uneducated unskilled unexperiance uncertified job that anyone in LA can do considering most people in LA, even the homeless own a car.
 

Carbuncle

Well-Known Member
Ever heard of Google maps? That basically destroyed the importantance of local street knowledge. Now any idiot with a four door car and no training can put on Google maps or Waze and more or less get the person close to their destination. Still an uneducated unskilled unexperiance uncertified job that anyone in LA can do considering most people in LA, even the homeless own a car.

I guess that’s why nearly 70% of all traffic citations issued in SF were given to Uber and Lyft drivers:


It also explains why inexperienced drivers consistently stop directly on corners of intersections, which is both illegal and very dangerous.

It also explains why inexperienced drivers let the apps do all the thinking so they drive massively distracted and mindlessly try to go left or through busy uncontrolled intersections during rush hour.

It also explains why experienced drivers with strong local knowledge consistently outperform people given apps in contests to see who gets where first.

And it explains why Uber and Lyft have, by far, the highest turnover rates ever seen in the industry.

The evidence says otherwise, brain trust.

You never substantiate any of your claims or arguments. Ever.

Rookie.
 

Alsace Struggle

Well-Known Member
I guess that’s why nearly 70% of all traffic citations issued in SF were given to Uber and Lyft drivers:


It also explains why inexperienced drivers consistently stop directly on corners of intersections, which is both illegal and very dangerous.

It also explains why inexperienced drivers let the apps do all the thinking so they drive massively distracted and mindlessly try to go left or through busy uncontrolled intersections during rush hour.

It also explains why experienced drivers with strong local knowledge consistently outperform people given apps in contests to see who gets where first.

And it explains why Uber and Lyft have, by far, the highest turnover rates ever seen in the industry.

The evidence says otherwise, brain trust.

You never substantiate any of your claims or arguments. Ever.

Rookie.
Qualifications to become an Uber driver in LA:

Need a certificate? No
Need any skill? No
Need any training? No
Need any formal education? No
Need an apprenticeship? No
Need any associations affiliation? No

Unless you can counter any of those claims, then what I said is a factual claim.

Only thing you can argue is danger. I already covered this. In the top most dangerous field, only two are low paying. Landscape laborers and rideshare drivers. This is because a combination of them not demanding more pay to work, and that since there is no training or skill involved in those jobs, they have an unlimited labor pool willing to work for almost nothing. Until you can fix those two, nothing is going to change.
 

666cartman666

Well-Known Member
You can't compare us to London cab drivers:
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3307245/the-knowledge-taxi-test-london-black-cab-drivers-exam/

Black cabbies must study some 320 routes and 25,000 streets and get to know them all by heart.
They also memorise roughly 20,000 landmarks and places of public interest, from tourist destinations to museums, parks, churches, theatres and schools.
The process typically takes between two and four years to complete and has been described as like having an atlas of London implanted into your brain.
Black cabbie hopefuls must then pass a written test and a series of oral exams before they can get their licence.
 

Carbuncle

Well-Known Member
Qualifications to become an Uber driver in LA:

Need a certificate? No
Need any skill? No
Need any training? No
Need any formal education? No
Need an apprenticeship? No
Need any associations affiliation? No

Unless you can counter any of those claims, then what I said is a factual claim.

Only thing you can argue is danger. I already covered this. In the top most dangerous field, only two are low paying. Landscape laborers and rideshare drivers. This is because a combination of them not demanding more pay to work, and that since there is no training or skill involved in those jobs, they have an unlimited labor pool willing to work for almost nothing. Until you can fix those two, nothing is going to change.

That’s actually very easy to refute. Because it’s a non sequitur.

In NYC you need all of the above to drive for U/L and similar platforms.

Uber and Lyft don’t require any of those because they want it to be as easy as possible to get as many people as possible on the platforms. This has resulted in over 1000 fatalities and tens of thousands of injuries, assaults, rapes, and robberies in the US alone.

Just in SF Uber and Lyft drivers account for nearly 70% of all traffic citations issued.

Go to any of Uber's and Lyft’s markets and you’ll routinely see drivers breaking numerous laws: staging in bus stops, passing school busses with stop signs and flashers deployed, staging on corners of busy intersections... Hell, I saw one Uber driver stop directly in the middle of Hermosa and Pier on a busy day and had four people rush out to his car. Most drivers illegally transport unaccompanied minors and infants without required seats. Most drivers allow passengers to enter with open containers of alcohol.

The failure of government and of the companies to require skills and knowledge testing has resulted in all of these problems and more.

Another unflattering metric? The astronomical turnover rate. Over 90% quit in a year or less. At the three year mark only 11% of all drivers activated are still doing the job.

You’re arguing that simply because these companies have eliminated crucial standards by disingenuously referring to them as “barriers to entry” that this means such standards are superfluous.

That’s a logical fallacy. In spades.

All of these standards were implemented over time in response to problems that arose in the industry. Not surprisingly, all the issues these standards were implemented to mitigate have come roaring back with a vengeance with the sloppy models employed by these nefarious and completely irresponsible companies.

You have no argument and no factual data to support it.

My Steel Man wipes his rear with your straw man.
 

Alsace Struggle

Well-Known Member
That’s actually very easy to refute. Because it’s a non sequitur.

In NYC you need all of the above to drive for U/L and similar platforms.

Uber and Lyft don’t require any of those because they want it to be as easy as possible to get as many people as possible on the platforms. This has resulted in over 1000 fatalities and tens of thousands of injuries, assaults, rapes, and robberies in the US alone.

Just in SF Uber and Lyft drivers account for nearly 70% of all traffic citations issued.

Go to any of Uber's and Lyft’s markets and you’ll routinely see drivers breaking numerous laws: staging in bus stops, passing school busses with stop signs and flashers deployed, staging on corners of busy intersections... Hell, I saw one Uber driver stop directly in the middle of Hermosa and Pier on a busy day and had four people rush out to his car. Most drivers illegally transport unaccompanied minors and infants without required seats. Most drivers allow passengers to enter with open containers of alcohol.

The failure of government and of the companies to require skills and knowledge testing has resulted in all of these problems and more.

Another unflattering metric? The astronomical turnover rate. Over 90% quit in a year or less. At the three year mark only 11% of all drivers activated are still doing the job.

You’re arguing that simply because these companies have eliminated crucial standards by disingenuously referring to them as “barriers to entry” that this means such standards are superfluous.

That’s a logical fallacy. In spades.

All of these standards were implemented over time in response to problems that arose in the industry. Not surprisingly, all the issues these standards were implemented to mitigate have come roaring back with a vengeance with the sloppy models employed by these nefarious and completely irresponsible companies.

You have no argument and no factual data to support it.

My Steel Man wipes his rear with your straw man.
It is really hard sometimes for me to believe you actually went to a four year higher education institution and you actually received a degree, supposedly. There is no logical fallacy, you basically agreed with me even in your response. What I said is the reality. What you said is fantasy. What I said is what is, and what you said is what you think should be. The truth is, in the US, with New York as the excemption, Uber and Lyft have been successful in destroying or circumventing taxi regulations. That is the reality. Uber and Lyft basically do whatever they want in the US. Now, if you think this is wrong and want to change this, then you should actually bring about the change. Laying in urine soaked sheets and whining about it on here does nothing! Why don't you lead the union movement? At the very least, tell us what you would do or what should be done to realistically bring about the regulations or restore them within 25 years. Otherwise your writings are just worthless rantings.
 

sadboy

Well-Known Member


Tell that to the hiring manager when you are trying to get a 100K job or even a 50K job.

Ive met drivers who want to quit and are like I will quit if I get a job paying me after taxes $1000 a week. Ive asked them what you got to offer in order to get that job?
...........................
NOTHING

No Degree
No Trade license/certificate (such as plumber, etc)
No Skill
No Union membership

Common answer, Ive worked in a factory that required nothing to get the job.

They have nothing and expect everything...

So tell me again how this is helpful in California?
 

Jon77

Well-Known Member
That’s actually very easy to refute. Because it’s a non sequitur.

In NYC you need all of the above to drive for U/L and similar platforms.

Uber and Lyft don’t require any of those because they want it to be as easy as possible to get as many people as possible on the platforms. This has resulted in over 1000 fatalities and tens of thousands of injuries, assaults, rapes, and robberies in the US alone.

Just in SF Uber and Lyft drivers account for nearly 70% of all traffic citations issued.

Go to any of Uber's and Lyft’s markets and you’ll routinely see drivers breaking numerous laws: staging in bus stops, passing school busses with stop signs and flashers deployed, staging on corners of busy intersections... Hell, I saw one Uber driver stop directly in the middle of Hermosa and Pier on a busy day and had four people rush out to his car. Most drivers illegally transport unaccompanied minors and infants without required seats. Most drivers allow passengers to enter with open containers of alcohol.

The failure of government and of the companies to require skills and knowledge testing has resulted in all of these problems and more.

Another unflattering metric? The astronomical turnover rate. Over 90% quit in a year or less. At the three year mark only 11% of all drivers activated are still doing the job.

You’re arguing that simply because these companies have eliminated crucial standards by disingenuously referring to them as “barriers to entry” that this means such standards are superfluous.

That’s a logical fallacy. In spades.

All of these standards were implemented over time in response to problems that arose in the industry. Not surprisingly, all the issues these standards were implemented to mitigate have come roaring back with a vengeance with the sloppy models employed by these nefarious and completely irresponsible companies.

You have no argument and no factual data to support it.

My Steel Man wipes his rear with your straw man.
I’m sorry carbuncle but I’d have to agree with the other guy.
I generally like pretty much everything you write otherwise.
I initially went to school to be a pilot because that’s what I wanted as a career .
I got my private, my instrument rating and my multi engine land
but then found out that it takes 20 years of backbreaking work before you reach anywhere close to being on the majors.
I currently work as a mechanic and I’m required by state of care California to do update training every two years to keep my smog license.
Do you have a small device since you have to have ASE’s, plu an L1 advance engine performance rating.
When I’m doing my regular job I feel it is a skilled job.

When I’m doing Uber on Friday and Saturday night I don’t feel like it’s anything other than dangerous.

I’m not using any special skills other than just driving safely and being courteous to customers of course.

I have a 4.95 on Uber and a five star rating on Lyft and have done 3200 rides.

But I do agree with you the pay should be a lot higher these companies are taking advantage of unskilled labor, and financially naïve people.

This app/scam would not work if ithis was a genuinely skilled labor were very few people could do it such as engineering or science jobs.

It doesn’t take too much to do this job unfortunately this job is attracting a lot people that are not even up to some basic standards and that’s why they wash out.

The demographics of the drivers are changing I see it at my shop with our customers that are Uber drivers.
Three years ago it was a different type of driver .

If the job is low skill and pays minimum-wage you’re going to get a different applicant then if you advertise for an engineering job.

So I’m not surprised at all a lotta guys can’t follow GPS don’t know that they can’t stop in a red or bus zones, can’t chew gum and walk at the same time.
Or confuse an app for dating with the app for giving somebody a safe ride home.
Hence the reputation we are starting to get.

Having said that there has to be some minimum standards that the government enforce.
Both on the quality of the driver and the minimum pay and benefit packages that should be set as a floor regardless of skills.

Without proper regulation these billionaires are going to keep exploiting the weak.
 

Carbuncle

Well-Known Member
I’m sorry carbuncle but I’d have to agree with the other guy.
I generally like pretty much everything you write otherwise.
I initially went to school to be a pilot because that’s what I wanted as a career .
I got my private, my instrument rating and my multi engine land
but then found out that it takes 20 years of backbreaking work before you reach anywhere close to being on the majors.
I currently work as a mechanic and I’m required by state of care California to do update training every two years to keep my smog license.
Do you have a small device since you have to have ASE’s, plu an L1 advance engine performance rating.
When I’m doing my regular job I feel it is a skilled job.

When I’m doing Uber on Friday and Saturday night I don’t feel like it’s anything other than dangerous.

I’m not using any special skills other than just driving safely and being courteous to customers of course.

I have a 4.95 on Uber and a five star rating on Lyft and have done 3200 rides.

But I do agree with you the pay should be a lot higher these companies are taking advantage of unskilled labor, and financially naïve people.

This app/scam would not work if ithis was a genuinely skilled labor were very few people could do it such as engineering or science jobs.

It doesn’t take too much to do this job unfortunately this job is attracting a lot people that are not even up to some basic standards and that’s why they wash out.

The demographics of the drivers are changing I see it at my shop with our customers that are Uber drivers.
Three years ago it was a different type of driver .

If the job is low skill and pays minimum-wage you’re going to get a different applicant then if you advertise for an engineering job.

So I’m not surprised at all a lotta guys can’t follow GPS don’t know that they can’t stop in a red or bus zones, can’t chew gum and walk at the same time.
Or confuse an app for dating with the app for giving somebody a safe ride home.
Hence the reputation we are starting to get.

Having said that there has to be some minimum standards that the government enforce.
Both on the quality of the driver and the minimum pay and benefit packages that should be set as a floor regardless of skills.

Without proper regulation these billionaires are going to keep exploiting the weak.

Whether you agree or not is moot. The facts are not on your side.

Failing to train drivers increases traffic fatalities and injuries. That’s a fact.

And it’s rather ridiculous to compare salaries in engineering to those of commercial drivers. I’m not advocating for that. You’re being hyperbolic.

However, London’s “the Knowledge” proves that standards matter and that not all drivers are created equal. You have to be as smart as an engineer to pass that test and you only get two cracks at it.

You’re comparing apples to oranges with your arguments.

BTW, my mother had her pilots license before her driver’s license when she was in high school. My brother flies for Hawaiian air. My father is a retired professional racer and he designed, engineered, fabricated, and built the cars and motorcycles he raced. He didn’t have a college degree but he was a brilliant human.

Standards matter. Especially in commercial driving professions. Them’s the facts.
 

Alsace Struggle

Well-Known Member
Whether you agree or not is moot. The facts are not on your side.

Failing to train drivers increases traffic fatalities and injuries. That’s a fact.

And it’s rather ridiculous to compare salaries in engineering to those of commercial drivers. I’m not advocating for that. You’re being hyperbolic.

However, London’s “the Knowledge” proves that standards matter and that not all drivers are created equal. You have to be as smart as an engineer to pass that test and you only get two cracks at it.

You’re comparing apples to oranges with your arguments.

BTW, my mother had her pilots license before her driver’s license when she was in high school. My brother flies for Hawaiian air. My father is a retired professional racer and he designed, engineered, fabricated, and built the cars and motorcycles he raced. He didn’t have a college degree but he was a brilliant human.

Standards matter. Especially in commercial driving professions. Them’s the facts.
Your father is an engineer. Your brother is a pilot. You drive for Uber? What did you do wrong in life to end up as an rideshare slave?
 

Jon77

Well-Known Member
I do agree with you standards matter 100% it’s a dangerous job and if it’s not done properly there can be deaths involved .

I think the only area we would disagree is whether or not driving safely is a high skill or not.

I was able to learn the skills that I used to this day, as far as driving, in about a month and a half of supervision under my father.

But how hard is that skill when you can learn it in about 45 days few hours after high school .

Congrats to your brother for the job with Hawaiian air ,so many times I second guess myself, maybe I should’ve stuck with it regardless of the hardships.

I have a customer who just retired as a pilot for a FedEx, early 50s done working, with a hell of a benefit package he is set for life.

Anyway its a disagreement but it’s a respectful disagreement,people don’t always see eye to eye.

I think we can both agree that there should be better regulations, there should be better pay, there should be better standards for the safety of all involved and also for the decency of treating people with common courtesy and respect.

But I don’t think this will last too long eventually the government will have to step in but by that time the insiders will already have sold their shares to mom and pop retail investors, they will have cash out by then.
 

Carbuncle

Well-Known Member
Because it's a low skill job/gig and any idiot can and does drive for Uber and gets paid.

False.

You obviously didn’t read any of the links posted.

Apparently when you say “any idiot” you’re projecting.
Post automatically merged:

Your father is an engineer. Your brother is a pilot. You drive for Uber? What did you do wrong in life to end up as an rideshare slave?

What did you do wrong to end up a bitter internet troll on up.net?
Post automatically merged:

Cocaine is a helluva drug!

I’m a midnight toker.

And that’s about it.
 

tarcham

Well-Known Member
Even if you are the most skilled and respected ride share driver in the history of ride share, you are still only King Turd of Poop Mountain. Enjoy the view. Pretty much goes for any driver who is not in a race car.
 
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