Licensing Process

Dougie

New Member
Hi All,

Just thought I would write a quick note about the licensing process if you have not held a P endorsement before. There is plenty of information available, but not much on how all of the processes work together. You can take or leave this friendly advice (no guarantees your experience will be the same as mine) and feel free to make comments on your licensing experience.

NOTE: I went through this process before UBER changed the rules about driver eligibility. It is not my intention to debate this, but if you want to0 be legally compliant in the Government/Police view this is still the process to follow.

You must have held a Full NZ Licence for at least 2 years before applying.

Step 1 - Medical

Do this first. Reason: If you don’t pass that there is not much point going any further or spending any more money. The doctor performing the examination fills in an NZTA medical form (DL9). This form is not available online, but GP’s should have a copy. It would pay for you to check they have when making an appointment. If they haven’t they can contact the NZTA and order some. Look here for info about various medical conditions:

https://www.nzta.govt.nz/driver-licences/getting-a-licence/medical-requirements/


Step 2 – P Endorsement (timeframe 8-10 weeks)

You can apply for your P endorsement immediately once you have your medical done. The reason to get in early with this is that the thing that takes the most time here is the police vetting check. You will also need to book and sit a practical test while the licensing process is occurring. If tou are worried about passing the fit and proper person check you can apply before taking any further steps for a notice of determination before taking the rest of the steps.
https://www.nzta.govt.nz/driver-licences/getting-an-endorsement/p-endorsement-for-carrying-passengers/

Step 2 - P Endorsement Course

Also, as part of the process you need to sit and pass a P endorsement course on the licencing and log book requirements.

Step 3 – Passenger Service Licence (timeframe 8-10 weeks)

Again best you get this under way promptly, as a vetting check is also required for this licence which can occur simultaneously with the P Endorsement check. The two can be done together – i.e. there is no need to wait for the P Endorsement before you apply for the PSL. The PSL requires an online test to be passed, but it is open book. With a bit of study, it is pretty straightforward. Study where to find things rather than intensely studying the minute detail and you will be well prepared.

www.nzta.govt.nz/assets/resources/.../passenger-service-licence-application.pdf


Step 4 – Practical Test

A full Licence test is part of your P Endorsement application. It may pay to consider getting a lesson before the test, particularly if you haven’t done on for a few years and things like hazard assessments while driving are foreign to you. It is a 20 minute test.

Watch the Full Licence Test Video here:


More info about the test procedure here:

http://nzta.govt.nz/assets/Driver-Licences/docs/full-test-guide.pdf


Step 5 – CoF

A CoF is required for your vehicle to run with Uber (or any Private Hire Service). A couple of things I got caught with here: Towbars need to be certified with a braked and unbraked weight (not for a WoF, but dop for a CoF. Also, your PSL must be shown as part of the CoF requirements. If you are using a car that isn’t already a taxi there will be a change of use charge. One thing you may have to consider is your child locks on the rear door. These must be disabled, or you have to put big red stickers on your back doors warning of their existence. I have disabled mine by placing red reflectorised tape over the mechanism so it can't be acitvated. One thing here. If you are thinking of someone like VTNZ and it is the forst CoF for your vehicle - call first to see if they can issue initial CoFs, which include a loading certificate. Not all can, as I found out.

https://vtnz.co.nz/personal-services/be-road-legal/certificate-of-fitness/?gclid=COGojqyL780CFQp_vQodwM4L-Q

Step 6 – Insurance

You need to have commercial (business) vehicle insurance. You should talk to your insurance company about this. My insurance company wanted $3600 as a premium, so I got another quote and it ended up being $1900. Shop around!

Upload to UBER

You can do this when you have all documentation or gradually as it comes in via the web site:

IMPORTANT

Once you have uploaded your documents (or once you have them all ready) you need to visit the UBER office (62-66 Vivian Street Wellington). This is the last essential step in activation:

If you chose to not to upload them yourself you need to bring with you:
1. Your Drivers Licence showing the P endorsement
2. Your P endorsement ID card
3. Your Private Hire service registration from the NZ Transport Agency
4. Your Passenger Service Licence (if you are driving under your own) or a copy of the person's PSL you are driving for.
5. A clear photo of your Certificate of Fitness taken from inside the vehicle
6. Proof of commercial vehicle insurance (not sure of this is required, but the web site indicates you do.

They will upload your documents (as required), take a photo of you and help you download the partner app (a separate app to the rider app).
 
Last edited:

boc

New Member
Hi All,

Just thought I would write a quick note about the licensing process if you have not held a P endorsement before. There is plenty of information available, but not much on how all of the processes work together. You can take or leave this friendly advice (no guarantees your experience will be the same as mine) and feel free to make comments on your licensing experience.

You must have held a Full NZ Licence for at least 2 years before applying.

Step 1 - Medical

Do this first. Reason: If you don’t pass that there is not much point going any further or spending any more money. The doctor performing the examination fills in an NZTA medical form (DL9). This form is not available online, but GP’s should have a copy. It would pay for you to check they have when making an appointment. If they haven’t they can contact the NZTA and order some. Look here for info about various medical conditions:

[Link will be inserted once I have permission - a like on this post will help!]


Step 2 – P Endorsement (timeframe 8-10 weeks)

You can apply for your P endorsement immediately once you have your medical done. The reason to get in early with this is that the thing that takes the most time here is the police vetting check. You will also need to book and sit a practical test while the licensing process is occurring. If tou are worried about passing the fit and proper person check you can apply before taking any further steps for a notice of determination before taking the rest of the steps.

[Link will be inserted once I have permission - a like on this post will help!]

Step 2 - P Endorsement Course

Also, as part of the process you need to sit and pass a P endorsement course on the licencing and log book requirements.

Step 3 – Passenger Service Licence (timeframe 8-10 weeks)

Again best you get this under way promptly, as a vetting check is also required for this licence which can occur simultaneously with the P Endorsement check. The two can be done together – i.e. there is no need to wait for the P Endorsement before you apply for the PSL. The PSL requires an online test to be passed, but it is open book. With a bit of study, it is pretty straightforward. Study where to find things rather than intensely studying the minute detail and you will be well prepared. Yiu can operate under someone else’s PSL, but the risk you take these is if they lose their PSL you are also off the road. Up to you.

[Link will be inserted once I have permission - a like on this post will help!]


Step 4 – Practical Test

A full Licence test is part of your P Endorsement application. It may pay to consider getting a lesson before the test, particularly if you haven’t done on for a few years and things like hazard assessments while driving are foreign to you. It is a 20 minute test.

Watch the Full Licence Test Video here:

[Link will be inserted once I have permission - a like on this post will help!]

More info about the test procedure here:

[Link will be inserted once I have permission - a like on this post will help!]


Step 5 – CoF

A CoF is required for your vehicle to run with Uber (or any Private Hire Service). A couple of things I got caught with here: Towbars need to be certified with a braked and unbraked weight (not for a WoF, but dop for a CoF. Also, your PSL must be shown as part of the CoF requirements. If you are using a car that isn’t already a taxi there will be a change of use charge. One thing you may have to consider is your child locks on the rear door. These must be disabled, or you have to put big red stickers on your back doors warning of their existence. I have disabled mine by placing red reflectorised tape over the mechanism so it can't be acitvated. One thing here. If you are thinking of someone like VTNZ and it is the forst CoF for your vehicle - call first to see if they can issue initial CoFs, which include a loading certificate. Not all can, as I found out.

[Link will be inserted once I have permission - a like on this post will help!]

Step 6 – Insurance

You need to have commercial (business) vehicle insurance. You should talk to your insurance company about this. My insurance company wanted $3600 as a premium, so I got another quote and it ended up being $1900. Shop around!

Upload to Uber

You can do this when you have all documentation or gradually as it comes in via the web site:

IMPORTANT

Once you have uploaded your documents (or once you have them all ready) you need to visit the UBER office (62-66 Vivian Street Wellington). This is the last essential step in activation:

If you chose to not to upload them yourself you need to bring with you:
1. Your Drivers Licence showing the P endorsement
2. Your P endorsement ID card
3. Your Private Hire service registration from the NZ Transport Agency
4. Your Passenger Service Licence (if you are driving under your own) or a copy of the person's PSL you are driving for.
5. A clear photo of your Certificate of Fitness taken from inside the vehicle
6. Proof of commercial vehicle insurance (not sure of this is required, but the web site indicates you do.

They will upload your documents (as required), take a photo of you and help you download the partner app (a separate app to the rider app).
 

boc

New Member
Hi Dougie
Is it true you don't need a COF and a WOF is acceptable also you don't need commercial insurance anymore.
 

Dougie

New Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #4
Hi There,

The information about this is a little confusing. Uber have put out a media release saying that WoF and normal insurance (rather than commercial) is OK, No P Endorsement is required and it is $20 on-boarding and around a week wait for approval. I have asked Uber some questions about this as it has implications for current partners also.

On the other hand, The Minister of Transport has been quoted in several media sources saying a P Endorsement is required and he expects the law to be followed....

My strong recommendation now would be to contact Uber direct for the good oil and pretty much ignore all of the above advice from me!
 

KiwiMorpheus

New Member
Hi Dougie
Is it true you don't need a COF and a WOF is acceptable also you don't need commercial insurance anymore.
Well who would you trust to know the law?

Uber is well known for pushing the envelope but I'm not taking the risk. I'll get my P endorsement and the vehicle I use will have CoF. I can do without the $5000 fine thanks, which Uber is unlikely to reimbuse me for, nor the demerits you;ll cop if caught. The law is clear, ride for hire of any form must have P endorsement, TSL and CoF.
 

Dougie

New Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #6
Hi,

Yes an interesting discussion. Certainly I'm pleased I went through the full licensing process above and don't have to worry about any of that. I do intend on going in to ask Uber about this stuff. There are lots of costing implications for current partners in the "new regime". For example only requiring 3rd party or "comprehensive" vehicle insurance is another point. I have commercial insurance at a higher cost than comprehensive. Question is if an insurance company refuses to pay out for a collision while working for Uber on a "comprehensive" policy, who pays? 2 insurance companies I talked to were very clear Uber work is not covered under a "comprehensive" policy. I have emailed Uber support and they (a few emails later) have advised me to go in to the office and discuss. I will be doing that. I would be interested to know who drivers out there are insured with? I got quoted $3600 from my long standing insurer State, and ended up going with Youi for about $1900 from memory. Neither would insure for part time work so I had to take a full commercial policy. Anyone else?

My strong advice to anyone is if they have any questions around these issues to go in to the partner centre to ask them. I failed to secure answers to many questions around this stuff via email.
 

boc

New Member
Hi all
It's hard getting a definitive answer from Uber by email, very vague.
I'll have to go down there but I had a mate go down there to complain about them changing the fee
they charge for new drivers from 20% to 25% he just spent over $2500 and they felt sorry for him and gave
him $500. He asked about the COF and he got a vague reply but thinks a WOF is ok. Does anyone know how/where we can get
a definitive answer?

I've only been driving for a bout 4 months so don't know how much exactly I'm earning after expenses but
I was talking to a guy in Alkld who hires Priuses to Taxi/Uber drivers reckons after expenses (petrol, insurance, maintenance etc) they
earn about $850 for a 50 hour week which equates to about $17 per hr - tax still needs to be deducted but some of
the expenses are claimable and also depreciation. What are some of the experiences for the Wellington drivers?
 

KiwiMorpheus

New Member
One must remember that Uber don't make the law.

The law is very clear, any ride for hire (and this is clearly defined) must have P endorsement, TSL (may not need this after law change next year) and CoF.
My point of view on these requirements is around safety. Safety for passengers in that the person that they are entrusting their safety with us a fit and proper person, safety that the vehicle is being maintained to a safe standard.

As I've said here and elsewhere, Uber seems to be about pushing the envelope but they're getting hammered in Australia having lost in Melbourne recently and Brisbane outright banning them.

Why take the risk? Compliance is there for good reasons. If you don't like it the complain to your MP and get the law changed.
 

ungawa

New Member
I wouldn't assume going into the Uber Office is going to make things any clearer than what you get by email. Last time I dropped in - they were kids who didn't have a clue what to do about Data blackouts (anyone done Breaker Bay dropoffs on Vodafone? What DO you do if you cannot close the trip because of no data coverage? They suggested dropping the rider off before the blackout. .... Pardon?).

I'm one of the drivers who paid $1500 for the licences (Uber stated they would reimburse that cost once I'd done 100 rides - cue Tui Ad) - and I am appalled that they are now flagrantly encouraging drivers to disregard the law - the age of cowboy drivers is really upon us, after what I thought was a great system of weeding out the pretender drivers having to commit to get the licences ...

Another thing regarding the 20% cost cut for riders - although Uber did state that "don't worry drivers - we've got you covered! We are giving you a guaranteed minimum if you drive during these times"
Bless them....... Oh - until I noticed that the guaranteed minimum only lasts until May 16th .... so - is that when the prices go back up too? No chance.

Gotta say - I'm getting mighty cynical about this company I once thought was massively progressive.
 

mikechch

Active Member
Done my P endorsement. What a rort, barely anything to do with safety. COF is even worse, why does the government feel the need to overide peoples freedom of choice. You can hardly download uber, hail a car then get in on accident without knowing what you're asking for.
 

KiwiMorpheus

New Member
Sucks I know but I'm OK with it sucking. At least criminals can't get legal making it safer for the riding public.

Also I learnt a lot about fatigue and how to manage it. I really didn't know about that and have observed myself getting fatigued since and manage it proerly now. I'm a selfemployed IT Contractor and amateur website tinkerer as well as SWMBOs taxi so I pull the late nights and early mornings regularly.
I agree with the work time rules but think the paper log books are pretty pedantic. I'll be using Logmate instead of messing around with paper.


Dougie, would you PM me please. I've a discussion I'd like to have with you regarding you most excellent guide and republishing it elsewhere.
 

Dougie

New Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #12
Done my P endorsement. What a rort, barely anything to do with safety. COF is even worse, why does the government feel the need to overide peoples freedom of choice. You can hardly download uber, hail a car then get in on accident without knowing what you're asking for.
Hi Mike,

I can sort of understand how you feel about this, but I disagree with you about the lack of focus around safety. I think the fatigue management and driving hours parts of the course are really important and safety focused. I certainly wouldn't like to have anyone driving my family member around that didn't know and adhere to those principles!

I do think the course i went to was not particularly well run (I wont mention the provider). I don't think they had done much thinking about Uber and had certainly not really explored with the NZTA how they should be operating. An example was that they told us Uber drivers were not required to keep a log book (bear in mind this was before the licensing debate came up). They also mentioned that the 7hr no break (less than 50k trips) provisions applied to Uber drivers not just taxis. In both those cases they were wrong. I managed to get the log book thing corrected while the course was still running, but the other went unchallenged until I rang the NZTA for clarification.

The assessment also was a bit of a joke I'm afraid. They just took us through it and we discussed or they supplied the answers.

Like most things - Uber has arrived and organisations like the NZTA are struggling to adjust/adapt. I really think the NZTA should be redesigning the P Endorsement course and making is more Uber (as opposed to taxi) focused. They should also be doing "mystery shopper" audits of their training providers.
 

Dougie

New Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #13
Sucks I know but I'm OK with it sucking. At least criminals can't get legal making it safer for the riding public.

Also I learnt a lot about fatigue and how to manage it. I really didn't know about that and have observed myself getting fatigued since and manage it proerly now. I'm a selfemployed IT Contractor and amateur website tinkerer as well as SWMBOs taxi so I pull the late nights and early mornings regularly.
I agree with the work time rules but think the paper log books are pretty pedantic. I'll be using Logmate instead of messing around with paper.


Dougie, would you PM me please. I've a discussion I'd like to have with you regarding you most excellent guide and republishing it elsewhere.
Hi Mate,

I have no problem with you posting it elsewhere (I have updated it a little and added the links). Provided it is made clear no comeback on me if it proves wrong/inaccurate. I can only vouch for my process earlier this year, not what it is now.
 

KiwiMorpheus

New Member
Hi Mate,

I have no problem with you posting it elsewhere (I have updated it a little and added the links). Provided it is made clear no comeback on me if it proves wrong/inaccurate. I can only vouch for my process earlier this year, not what it is now.
I'd like to publish it attributed, but I can do as a minimum a link back to here so people know where we got it from. We will of course be adding, as you pointed out, clear disclaimers and warnings.
 
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