• UberPeople.NET - Independent community of rideshare drivers. It's FREE to be a person and enjoy all the benefits of membership. JOIN US! CLICK HERE

Illegal Activity / Unsafe transportation / Insurance Fraud

JustTreatMeFair

Well-Known Member
Across the country every day UBER/LYFT are complicit in crimes being committed by the hundreds of thousands.

How long before we see regulation of the Industry?

Ping!

1) Attention has been diverted from the road to the device with all analytical resources channeled to making decisions about acceptance/canceling after acceptance/navigation

Ping!

2) Illegal U-Turns, lane changes without signaling, sudden stops, ignoring traffic control devices and signs occurs as drivers rush(?) to the pick-up spot.

Ping!

3) vehicles are driven in need of maintenance. A random inspection of any area where vehicles queue up will find cars driven by illegals using someone else's documents, vehicles in need of tires, lights, brakes or chocks......


Ping!

4) Drivers are under insured or not insured at all as they drop off a passenger until they pick up the next one because their insurance company will refuse any claim related to an accident occurring with the vehicle used for ride share activities. Drivers lie or ignore the questions designed to identify the activity to save money.

UBER/LYFT knows all of this and more and actually have real time data showing vehicles with passengers in them exceeding legal speed limits, not stopping at stop signs etc.....

Each and every Ping! generated launches a tremendous number of people across the country on a task where laws are regularly ignored.


Sooner or later it will come to an end and the government will step in and regulate the industry. It is the lack of government oversight of the industry that has allowed it to reach the depths it has.

When it occurs... Embrace it instead of resisting it.

Regulatory agencies make sure the people we drive get in an elevator that is inspected with some regularity. They insure the safe operation of traffic control devices as well as placement of directional and safety/warning signs. Regulatory agencies insure the gas that is in the tanks is transported there in a safe manner as well as stored and dispensed in a regulated fashion.

Think about it. How many other professional drivers involved in transporting anything on the roads of the country do so without government oversight, special training, safety inspections etc.....

UBER/LYFT like to say they are "technology companies".... They have the technology to make it all a lot safer.

Over the road truck drivers are not going to show up at the wrong address to pick up or drop off without it being noticed and dealt with. They drive vehicles monitored with speed, braking, acceleration and braking evaluated regularly.

Insurance companies have begun the transition to live monitoring of their insured's driving habits not just while being insured but as part of their acceptance process.

No system is as broke as ride share is for as long as it has been broken and not seen it come to pass that the Govt steps in to force controls.

It won't be a bad thing. It will be easy for rates to be raised and begrudgingly accepted by the consumers when it happens.

What do you think? Do you think regulation of the ride share industry is needed? Due?

Do you agree or disagree that it could/would lead to stabilization of the industry and reasonable compensation being in place that would compensate drivers for maintaining their vehicles to acceptable standards and performing the service in an safe and acceptable manner?

Of course the regulatory agency will need to be funded which would come in the form of regulatory fees on every trip, revenue from inspections and enforcement as well.

How is it that the Trillions of dollars in rideshare revenue has flown under the radar for so long across the country? Why is there not a politician out there with a plan to fund some need not pushing for an UBER/LYFT tax?
 

ECOMCON

Well-Known Member
Across the country every day UBER/LYFT are complicit in crimes being committed by the hundreds of thousands.

How long before we see regulation of the Industry?

Ping!

1) Attention has been diverted from the road to the device with all analytical resources channeled to making decisions about acceptance/canceling after acceptance/navigation

Ping!

2) Illegal U-Turns, lane changes without signaling, sudden stops, ignoring traffic control devices and signs occurs as drivers rush(?) to the pick-up spot.

Ping!

3) vehicles are driven in need of maintenance. A random inspection of any area where vehicles queue up will find cars driven by illegals using someone else's documents, vehicles in need of tires, lights, brakes or chocks......


Ping!

4) Drivers are under insured or not insured at all as they drop off a passenger until they pick up the next one because their insurance company will refuse any claim related to an accident occurring with the vehicle used for ride share activities. Drivers lie or ignore the questions designed to identify the activity to save money.

UBER/LYFT knows all of this and more and actually have real time data showing vehicles with passengers in them exceeding legal speed limits, not stopping at stop signs etc.....

Each and every Ping! generated launches a tremendous number of people across the country on a task where laws are regularly ignored.


Sooner or later it will come to an end and the government will step in and regulate the industry. It is the lack of government oversight of the industry that has allowed it to reach the depths it has.

When it occurs... Embrace it instead of resisting it.

Regulatory agencies make sure the people we drive get in an elevator that is inspected with some regularity. They insure the safe operation of traffic control devices as well as placement of directional and safety/warning signs. Regulatory agencies insure the gas that is in the tanks is transported there in a safe manner as well as stored and dispensed in a regulated fashion.

Think about it. How many other professional drivers involved in transporting anything on the roads of the country do so without government oversight, special training, safety inspections etc.....

UBER/LYFT like to say they are "technology companies".... They have the technology to make it all a lot safer.

Over the road truck drivers are not going to show up at the wrong address to pick up or drop off without it being noticed and dealt with. They drive vehicles monitored with speed, braking, acceleration and braking evaluated regularly.

Insurance companies have begun the transition to live monitoring of their insured's driving habits not just while being insured but as part of their acceptance process.

No system is as broke as ride share is for as long as it has been broken and not seen it come to pass that the Govt steps in to force controls.

It won't be a bad thing. It will be easy for rates to be raised and begrudgingly accepted by the consumers when it happens.

What do you think? Do you think regulation of the ride share industry is needed? Due?

Do you agree or disagree that it could/would lead to stabilization of the industry and reasonable compensation being in place that would compensate drivers for maintaining their vehicles to acceptable standards and performing the service in an safe and acceptable manner?

Of course the regulatory agency will need to be funded which would come in the form of regulatory fees on every trip, revenue from inspections and enforcement as well.

How is it that the Trillions of dollars in rideshare revenue has flown under the radar for so long across the country? Why is there not a politician out there with a plan to fund some need not pushing for an UBER/LYFT tax?
TL : DR
 

BCS DRIVER

Well-Known Member
1) Attention has been diverted from the road to the device with all analytical resources channeled to making decisions about acceptance/canceling after acceptance/navigation
How would you propose the ping gets to you if not by the device? And how could regulation possibly weigh in on that?

2) Illegal U-Turns, lane changes without signaling, sudden stops, ignoring traffic control devices and signs occurs as drivers rush(?) to the pick-up spot.
Regulation cannot stop anyone from doing stupid and illegal things. Even if U/L can track these things and report it to the local LE nothing can happen. Misdemeanor traffic infractions must be witnessed by LE before anything can happen.

3) vehicles are driven in need of maintenance. A random inspection of any area where vehicles queue up will find cars driven by illegals using someone else's documents, vehicles in need of tires, lights, brakes or chocks......
I'm pretty sure all states require annual safety inspections. They certainly do in Texas and must be done before you can do the yearly registration renewal. I receive notice in advance from U/L before my registration expires and have to submit proof it has been renewed. Same for insurance.

4) Drivers are under insured or not insured at all as they drop off a passenger until they pick up the next one because their insurance company will refuse any claim related to an accident occurring with the vehicle used for ride share activities. Drivers lie or ignore the questions designed to identify the activity to save money.
Agreed they lie or ignore the questions which is where greed comes in. But sometimes it's ignorance that a ride share endorsement is needed. As to under insured what would you say the collision and liability minimum amount should be?

To sum up I'm not against regulation. I do fail to see where more regulation could possibly result in more compensation to the driver. If U/L's cost of doing business increases then the opposite happens. Less compensation.
 

Dammit Mazzacane

Well-Known Member
How would you propose the ping gets to you if not by the device? And how could regulation possibly weigh in on that?
Nanny state accelerameter inside the device.
If the car's moving, the TNCs could make it so you're temporarily removed from the ping algorithm. If you're parked with app-on, you're available for summoning. A government regulation could require such code be inserted into the app.

They tried that with the iPhone or Samsung Galaxy a couple of years ago with a "don't text and drive" nanny system... I think (It was the iPhone - source: https://techcrunch.com/2017/06/22/do-not-disturb-while-driving-feature-rolls-out-in-apples-newest-ios-11-beta/ )
 

JustTreatMeFair

Well-Known Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #9
Misdemeanor traffic infractions must be witnessed by LE before anything can happen.
That's not true.

An accident occurs where a car runs a red light.

Drivers of vehicles involved tell officer Driver A ran the light causing the accident.

Officer cites Driver A for failure to yield right of way/ignoring the requirement to stop at the light based on the statements of the two witnesses.

Driver A now has to appear in court to fight it or deal with it through pleading it out/defensive driving/differed adjudication etc.

Driver A can FIGHT it of course, request a trial and hope the witnesses that gave statements do not show up in which case it would get dismissed
 

BCS DRIVER

Well-Known Member
That's not true.

An accident occurs where a car runs a red light.

Drivers of vehicles involved tell officer Driver A ran the light causing the accident.

Officer cites Driver A for failure to yield right of way/ignoring the requirement to stop at the light based on the statements of the two witnesses.

Driver A now has to appear in court to fight it or deal with it through pleading it out/defensive driving/differed adjudication etc.

Driver A can FIGHT it of course, request a trial and hope the witnesses that gave statements do not show up in which case it would get dismissed
What you say is all true. But the case you cite is an accident which leaves physical proof that a violation has occurred, unlike an illegal U turn or speeding etc.

Nanny state accelerameter inside the device.
If the car's moving, the TNCs could make it so you're temporarily removed from the ping algorithm. If you're parked with app-on, you're available for summoning. A government regulation could require such code be inserted into the app.

They tried that with the iPhone or Samsung Galaxy a couple of years ago with a "don't text and drive" nanny system... I think (It was the iPhone - source: https://techcrunch.com/2017/06/22/do-not-disturb-while-driving-feature-rolls-out-in-apples-newest-ios-11-beta/ )
I'm not saying the technology isn't there to stop driver distraction due to phone or whatever. Your example is not a practical solution, at least for me and driving ride share. When driving ride share my market pretty much demands me to drive for pings. I'm on the move 90+ % of the time. There are no hot spots, except the bar district at closing, to sit and wait.

I want to add to be careful what you wish for concerning regulation. Quite often, when implemented, it comes back and bites the average citizen in the ass.
 

JustTreatMeFair

Well-Known Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #11
What you say is all true. But the case you cite is an accident which leaves physical proof that a violation has occurred, unlike an illegal U turn or speeding etc.
I disagree. An accident simply demonstrates that an accident occurred. Accidents happen all the time and do not always entail a law being broke.

My comments come from recent personal experience. My wife was recently in an accident and was issued a ticket based on what 2 other drivers stated after the accident occurred. The police officer "apologized" to her (I was there as well) and told her to request a trial and when the other 2 people do not show up, since he did not witness the violation, it would get dismissed. He stated "they" never show up having an aversion to courts. He also issued tickets to the other 2 drivers who were non English speaking immigrants without drivers licenses and 1 expired vehicle registration.

People are routinely charged and at times arrested based on statements from others. Officers do not have to witness a crime.

I want to add to be careful what you wish for concerning regulation. Quite often, when implemented, it comes back and bites the average citizen in the ass.
I think the "average citizen" drives a routinely inspected vehicle in good repair and would be minimally inconvenienced by requirements that are needed.

I do believe the driving numbers would be impacted however as a fair number or people driving are doing so regularly breaking laws and driving marginally maintained vehicles that would not stand up to being inspected.

In the airport Que last night I parked between an aging Malibu with bald tires and a Taurus that had been in an accident and the front bumper was being held on with baling wire. Take a look around yourself with safety in mind at other vehicles and I think you
will see many examples yourself.

Technology already exists and is used with commercial drivers by the trucking industry. You see vehicles stopped and being inspected regularly.

Think like a politician and Rideshare is an untapped revenue source ripe for regulation.

It's regulation that keeps the taxi business from being competitive and costs them market share.
 

UberBastid

Well-Known Member
That's not true.

An accident occurs where a car runs a red light.

Drivers of vehicles involved tell officer Driver A ran the light causing the accident.

Officer cites Driver A for failure to yield right of way/ignoring the requirement to stop at the light based on the statements of the two witnesses.

Driver A now has to appear in court to fight it or deal with it through pleading it out/defensive driving/differed adjudication etc.

Driver A can FIGHT it of course, request a trial and hope the witnesses that gave statements do not show up in which case it would get dismissed
You do know that each state has different traffic laws, right?
Are you sure that's the way it is in Maryland? Ohio? Florida?
I know that I called the cops for kids racing up and down the street in our neighborhood. He said that if I want to sign the citation, he'd write it out -- then it would be me bringing charges against them (kind of like a citizens arrest).
He then said that it may open me up to civil litigation for false arrest.
If HE gets a civil suit filed against him the city attorney represents him. Who represents me? Whoever I can pay for.
I told him never mind, I will simply drag the prick out of the car and beat his ass.

He laughed and said he'd talk to them about it. Hasn't happened since.
 

Merc7186

Well-Known Member
Ping!

At what does the driver assume responsibility for their actions????

Your logic is flawed.
 

Aw Jeez

Well-Known Member
BCS Driver:
I'm pretty sure all states require annual safety inspections. They certainly do in Texas and must be done before you can do the yearly registration renewal.
That's not true. Here in Florida we have no requirement for annual vehicle inspection.
 

BCS DRIVER

Well-Known Member
My wife was recently in an accident and was issued a ticket based on what 2 other drivers stated after the accident occurred
She was obviously at fault and committed a violation based on his observation of the scene and eyewitness account. Regardless of whether it was dropped because the others failed to show up in court.

I do believe the driving numbers would be impacted however as a fair number or people driving are doing so regularly breaking laws and driving marginally maintained vehicles that would not stand up to being inspected.
Can you swear you've never broken any traffic law? Define regularly. As to marginally maintained the annual state inspection will catch these.

I think the "average citizen" drives a routinely inspected vehicle in good repair and would be minimally inconvenienced by requirements that are needed.
I would be more than minimally inconvenienced if any LE detains me for a safety inspection at their whim.

Think like a politician and Rideshare is an untapped revenue source ripe for regulation.
Revenue for who? U/L? I think not. Even if that revenue is for U/L the drivers will see none of it.

It's regulation that keeps the taxi business from being competitive and costs them market share.
No it's them charging 2019 rates in 2019.

There are regulations and laws already in place for all vehicles on the road. You seem to want more? How about a regulation that requires 4 point seat belt harnesses for the driver and all passengers? Automatic fire suppression systems? On Star requirement? Willing to pay for all that? Where does it end?

As to illegal driving do you wish to be monitored at all times? Drive 1 mile over the speed limit. Automatic deactivation. Front of car a bit over the white line at a red light/stop sign. Automatic deactivation. Failure to signal in a timely manner a lane change. Automatic deactivation.

Your whole reasoning behind this IMHO is to cut down on the number of ants on the road. Good luck with that.

BCS Driver:
That's not true. Here in Florida we have no requirement for annual vehicle inspection.
That's news to me but you are correct.

"Florida used to have required emissions and safety testing, but this program only lasted a few years. To this day, it’s the subject of fiery political debate. Safety checks could go a long way toward preventing car accidents and other injuries, but it’s unclear if this program will resume. For now, it’s each driver’s responsibility to make sure their vehicle is in good working order – and those who neglect to maintain their vehicles, and cause serious injury, could be liable for damages."

SMH @ Florida
 

Dammit Mazzacane

Well-Known Member
WA State uses a smog inspection, not a roadworthiness one. As long as it passes emissions, you’re generally good to go.

No it's (taxis) charging 2019 rates in 2019.
Meter rates often are set by government code, and one could argue its a built-in part of doing business as the taxi co. supplies the vehicle. (Refer to the earlier conversation about amortizing tooling costs)
Also, personnel- maybe a taxi owner-operator could do it cheaper but the rates are set arbitrarily and equally in big cities, I thought,
 

Christinebitg

Well-Known Member
It won't be a bad thing.
You've obviously never worked in an industry that has a lot if government regulation.

For the past 10 years, I've worked in insurance related businesses. One office that I worked in had about 200 people working in it. One of them was a person whose full time was to track insurance licenses. "Is so-and-so licensed where they need to be for the clients they're representing right now? What licenses are required, and in which jurisdictions?"

I worked in a refinery environmental department in southern California. "Do we need to apply for a permit change for X unit to change the motor/control valve/ monitoring system that we need to do? What happens if that permit application is denied? Can we still run the unit, or are we out of compliance?"

You really haven't thought this through.

Christine

Illegal U-Turns
How many times when youre driving have you noticed that the app is wrong?

It's pretty common to be told to turn right, and you're at an intersection that has two or three No Right Turn signs.

Or maybe the app tells you to go a couple miles out of your way because it doesn't know about a shortcut through a parking lot. Do you want to get deactivated for that, even though the person in the back seat of the car told you to do it?

How about where the speed limit has recently been increased, because a construction project has just been completed. Do you get deactivated for that?

That's the world youre wishing for. If you think dealing with Rohit in customer service has been difficult, picture what you would do if his job is being done by a smart phone app. Do you see any downsides to this approach?

Christine
 

oldfart

Well-Known Member
To answer your questions:

What do you think? Do you think regulation of the ride share industry is needed? Due?

Yes
Yes
And
Yes

Someone in another post is complaining about too many drivers and a constant complaint here is rates are too low. Regulation would solve both problems
 
Top